Could this possibly be the way this farce ends - with Mueller indicting Clinton, and maybe a few other Democrats - just in time for the election?
David
I can hear the resemblance!I was watching Trump's rally and I was wondering how he developed his speaking style. He doesn't speak like most politicians. When you listen to the local pols that speak at the rallies they often use a style many politicians use where they are obviously trying to get the crowd excited. Trump's style is a more subtle. Then I remembered I had heard that Trump's family attended the church where Norman Vincent Peale was a minister. I am wondering if Trump is influenced by Peale's speaking style. (I'm not referring to the prose style, but to aspects of the delivrey: pitch, tone of voice, dynamics, and tempo.)
Allow unfettered capitalism in the hope that some trickle down crumbs fall off the top table before the next unsustainable bubble bursts?
Well really, it was unfettered capitalism that gave us 'free trade'(FT). They weren't fools - they knew damn well that FT would undercut workers in the West, and probably result in horrible conditions for those who did the jobs. The Democrats aren't going to dismantle capitalism, or make it work better, they are going to sign as many trade deals as possible, and increase the numbers of jobless at home. Hopefully, of course they won't get the chance!
David
I think Western countries owe their success to many other things apart from capitalism, and anyway, 'ism's don't always stay the same - they just morph over time. The modern concept that you send production - and even some services - abroad is just a mistake. I mean there simply is no way that an American or a Western European can 'compete' with someone from the Third World, and the bulk of the workers in the West displaced in that way, can't re-train as software developers or whatever.Free market capitalism is when individuals are allowed the freedom to decide what to produce, how much to produce, and how much to charge for it. It is how our society decides how many i-phones and pencils to manufacture and how much to charge for them. The law of supply and demand work much better than having the government make those decisions. Centralized planning like that doesn't work.
I think people don't like capitalism because it results in inequality. Some people get rich off the labor of people who are poor. But without the capitalists, everyone is poor - living from subsistence agriculture. So even though the capitalists get very rich, the poor are still better off. In developing countries we see that people even prefer working in the city in sweat shops to subsistence agriculture - just as people did in western countries during our industrial revolution. In my opinion most poverty is caused by bad government that restricts free trade and inhibits economic growth. When the economy is growing corporations have to compete for workers which raises wages and improves working conditions. I support some government regulation for safe working conditions, child labor, environmental protection, assistance to people who are disabled, etc (these issues have to be dealt with under any economic system, not just capitalism - capitalism is not anarchy) but overall I think if you try to enforce fairness by redistributing money from capitalists to the poor, it will not have the desired effect because it will act as a disincentive to the capitalists and they will produce less so there will be less to redistribute - if you keep raising taxes to compensate, you will get a negative feedback loop that destroys the economy. I know some people have a strong opinion about fairness and care more about fairness than the overall standard of living. I don't object to people having that opinion, what I object to is when people mischaracterize capitalism unfairly. Capitalism is not an inherently evil system that necessarily leads to oppression of the workers. Capitalism is the system that has raised standards of living from the middle ages to the 21st century.
I'm retired. My annual expenses are close to the poverty level, it's my choice, I could spend more if I wanted to. I'm not materialistic and I don't have fancy tastes. But there is no way I would want to go back to living the way they did during the middle ages, or even the way they lived 100 years ago. Most of the people who are considered poor in western countries are much better off because of capitalism than they would be without capitalism - even though some people think it is "unfair". And as I wrote above, I think the crushing poverty that exists in some countries is caused by bad government that restricts free trade and inhibits economic growth.
I think Western countries owe their success to many other things apart from capitalism, and anyway, 'ism's don't always stay the same - they just morph over time. The modern concept that you send production - and even some services - abroad is just a mistake. I mean there simply is no way that an American or a Western European can 'compete' with someone from the Third World, and the bulk of the workers in the West displaced in that way, can't re-train as software developers or whatever.
The fact that there is a theoretical equilibrium, where everyone gets paid what they are worth, doesn't work in the real world - basically because the equilibrium isn't stable. So the very rich become obscenely rich.
I agree with this to some extent, but there is another side to the issue. Competition leads to technological advances. If the US restricted imported electronics from Asia, US companies would not have had to work as hard to keep up. We would make more electronics domestically than we do now, but they would be vastly inferior. What Trump is saying about the steel and aluminium industires is not that we have to keep out imports to maintain domestic production for secuity purposes, but that we have to keep out imports that are priced artificially low due to subsidies by foreign governments. Domestic companies should be protected from unfair foreign competition but they also should be exposed to competition so they don't stagnate.Sure, the answer isn't to give a lot more money to the governments to fix the problems, but I think blocking trade deals might be a good start. If the US once again makes most of the electronics it needs (say), is that unreasonable? Is it really safe to have to import electronics goods and lose the know how to do this work?
David
I am right behind fracking, as you know :) However, the free trade rules allowed manufacturers and others to move their work abroad. Not only has this impoverished Western workers, but it has led to other problems. For example, there have been instances of bank frauds performed by workers in India that process bank accounts. The problem is the vast difference between the money they earn and the money they see in the bank accounts the process.I'm not sure what you mean by "mistake". Who is making the mistake? What exactly should they do differently?
I don't think you can generalize because commodity prices and technology also change. Automation reduces labor costs. Fracking is making energy prices in the US so low that it compensates to some extent for the higher labor costs here. That in large part is why manufacturing jobs are coming back into the US. It is a trend that pre-dates Trump.
The problem is that while average wealth may be rising, some people are doing terribly out of the present system, and that needs fixing. For example, there are people doing two or even three cleaning jobs.What is wrong with someone becoming "obscenely rich" as long as every one else is also becoming better off at the same time? It isn't a zero sum game.
Well that sounds fine until you think about loans being made to people to buy things with the near certaintity that the loans would default. I don't know exactly how it is that people can do that and make money, but obviously it fuels bank crashes that hurt a lot of people.Wealth is created by labor, production, invention etc etc. There isn't a fixed amount of wealth in the world like there is land area. Obscenely rich people, unless they hoard cash or gold are investing their wealth in ways that are economically productive. Bank deposits are loaned to people who want to buy cars or houses. Stocks represent ownership in companies that hire workers, buy from suppliers and sell goods to consumers. Corporate Bonds represent loans that allow companies to invest in new plants hire workers and expand in other ways. That obscenely rich person has provided jobs to many workers who don't have the desire or ability to start their own companies, he lends money to people so they can buy cars and homes, etc etc. The richer he gets the richer everyone else gets too. If the government decides to tax his wealth and give it to the poor, he will change what he does with his money and the rest of society will be the worse for it. (Another problem is that the government will use the distribution of tax dollars to control the population.)
Well some Asian goods would still come in, but with a tariff, This would exert pressure on domestic suppliers, so the urge to compete could be maintained. As we lose control of sectors like electronics, the West becomes the new Third World!I agree with this to some extent, but there is another side to the issue. Competition leads to technological advances. If the US restricted imported electronics from Asia, US companies would not have had to work as hard to keep up. We would make more electronics domestically than we do now, but they would be vastly inferior.
What Trump is saying about the steel and aluminium industires is not that we have to keep out imports to maintain domestic production for security purposes, but that we have to keep out imports that are priced artificially low due to subsidies by foreign governments. Domestic companies should be protected from unfair foreign competition but they also should be exposed to competition so they don't stagnate.
I am right behind fracking, as you know :) However, the free trade rules allowed manufacturers and others to move their work abroad. Not only has this impoverished Western workers, but it has led to other problems. For example, there have been instances of bank frauds performed by workers in India that process bank accounts. The problem is the vast difference between the money they earn and the money they see in the bank accounts the process.
Ideally it would be nice to see a lot less trade, with companies serving the countries in which they are situated. I think the global scale of many operations may just be too large and unstable.
True, but this is in countries with low economic growth due to government policy. Trump has cut business taxes and regulations a well known and simple recipe for increasing economic growth and unemployment is at historic lows and wages are up here. If government would get out of the way, human ingenuity and energy would raise everyone's standard of living.The problem is that while average wealth may be rising, some people are doing terribly out of the present system, and that needs fixing. For example, there are people doing two or even three cleaning jobs.
I don't agree this is an inevitable consequence of what I wrote. I am okay with regulating banking if it is done properly. The banking crisis was caused because US banks were forced by law to make bad loans to poor people. Those loans got packaged and sold around the world hiding the fact that they were risky. In the US, Republicans wanted to remedy this before it blew up but Democrats said they were racists who wanted to keep minorities from getting loans (home mortgages).Well that sounds fine until you think about loans being made to people to buy things with the near certaintity that the loans would default. I don't know exactly how it is that people can do that and make money, but obviously it fuels bank crashes that hurt a lot of people.
Well some Asian goods would still come in, but with a tariff, This would exert pressure on domestic suppliers, so the urge to compete could be maintained. As we lose control of sectors like electronics, the West becomes the new Third World!
Well to some extent I guess I would out Trump Trump if I were in power!
David
I think the point is, that large corporations like lax regulation - or at least if they find lax regulation they are ready to exploit it. It is almost impossible to regulate the whole world to a decent standard, so free trade means that large corporations exploit countries with low standards of worker protection and low wages.Where do you draw the lines? Would things be better in the US if each state didn't trade with other states in the US? European countries formed and economic union for a reason. Is it harmful to grow economic regions beyond a certain size? How big is too big?
We are blessed.Trump ran because he wanted to do certain things that he had to be president to do