Brexit

I watched a replay of the Dimbleby BBC debate on YouTube, and thought the Remain campaigners were very unsympathetic. Khan behaved like a bellicose East Enders character and said immigration concerns were driven by racism. While that is undoubtedly true in some cases, the attempt to place any discussion of inward migration as a potential hate crime was absurd and mischievous.

My fears were summed up by Peter Hitchens, a long term critic of the EU and advocate for leaving. He said the result didn't matter as he seriously doubted whether there was any credible leader with the ability to move Britain forward after Brexit. Boris has his eye on the premiership but for all his Churchillian pretensions has few political convictions, and the rest are 1980s Tory backstabbers or unreconstructed Trotskyists.
If the vote to exit the EU wins out I see years of considerable austerity and intrigue ahead, but the moral position of dismantling a discredited political union may be sufficient compensation. I certainly don't envisage a sunlit Victorian free trade upland awaiting on Friday 24th.
 
gabriel said:
I watched a replay of the Dimbleby BBC debate on YouTube, and thought the Remain campaigners were very unsympathetic. Khan behaved like a bellicose East Enders character and said immigration concerns were driven by racism. While that is undoubtedly true in some cases, the attempt to place any discussion of inward migration as a potential hate crime was absurd and mischievous.

My fears were summed up by Peter Hitchens, a long term critic of the EU and advocate for leaving. He said the result didn't matter as he seriously doubted whether there was any credible leader with the ability to move Britain forward after Brexit. Boris has his eye on the premiership but for all his Churchillian pretensions has few political convictions, and the rest are 1980s Tory backstabbers or unreconstructed Trotskyists.
If the vote to exit the EU wins out I see years of considerable austerity and intrigue ahead, but the moral position of dismantling a discredited political union may be sufficient compensation. I certainly don't envisage a sunlit Victorian free trade upland awaiting on Friday 24th.
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I am so glad you came back to the forum Gabriel and even though I understand about 80% of what you write the other 20% is something to strive for :)

As for the decision that will affect my country of origin for many years to come, like you, it is not a decision that I would relish. I have heard that the vote is not even necessarily the final result. Any further thoughts/info is appreciated.
 
Red said:
I am so glad you came back to the forum Gabriel and even though I understand about 80% of what you write the other 20% is something to strive for :)

As for the decision that will affect my country of origin for many years to come, like you, it is not a decision that I would relish. I have heard that the vote is not even necessarily the final result. Any further thoughts/info is appreciated.
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That's extraordinarily kind of you, Red. I hadn't heard the vote may not be final, it's hard to imagine Britain's EU membership continuing with a majority of the population against it. I aim for transparency and aperture ; ) but often fall into opacity, and even profanity.
 
Remain now in a slight lead. Looking at the breakdown, looks so far like Scotland is going to screw it up for Brexit hopefuls.
 
Ian Gordon said:
Hey, malf, how come commonwealthers like us don't get a say?

We're too common, I guess...

...

:D
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This is a very good question. NZ was hammered economically in the 70s as the UK got cosy with Europe.

http://www.nzhistory.net.nz/culture/the-1970s/1973

Britain joins the European Economic Community
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Britain had first applied for admission to the European Economic Community (EEC) in 1963. British membership of the EEC would in effect exclude New Zealand from the British market. The 1971Luxembourg agreement brought New Zealand butter, cheese and lamb exports some time when Britain finally joined the EEC in 1973. By then New Zealand’s exports to the ‘Mother Country’ had fallen to less than 30% of all exports, and within two decades they would be below 10%.

As well as our major export market, Britain had long been New Zealand’s main supplier of imports. When Britain entered the EEC all bilateral agreements between New Zealand and Britain had to be terminated, and preferential treatment of British imports into New Zealand ended in 1977. From 43% of our total imports in 1960, imports from Britain had fallen to 14.5% by 1980.
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