Challenge to materialist atheist accepted

Paul C. Anagnostopoulos

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#82
I see the point.....but that's like saying if I ate a damn good turkey sandwich today that it wouldn't be just as good if I had the same turkey sandwich 10, 20, 1000 years from now.
Correct. There is no absolute goodness. It's relative to all sorts of things, one being that I don't do it day in and day out forever.

~~ Paul
 

Paul C. Anagnostopoulos

Nap, interrupted.
Member
#83
None of us with our hugely limited mental capacity can comprehend eternity. Why are we trying? How about this? Try to comprehend eternity backwards as in ... where have we been for eternity in opposed to where are we going for eternity. It is incomprehensible. Time doesn't work linearly outside the known physical universe. Eternity is neither a segment, ray or a line as it is not confined to geometric or any other physical boundaries.
I'm tempted to agree with you, in which case hypothesizing that existing forever would be a good thing is not based on any rational knowledge or model. However, without the passage of time, I would not be me. So to say that I might exist forever after I die is misleading.

~~ Paul
 
#85
I'm tempted to agree with you, in which case hypothesizing that existing forever would be a good thing is not based on any rational knowledge or model. However, without the passage of time, I would not be me. So to say that I might exist forever after I die is misleading.

~~ Paul
Or perhaps you always have existed for eternity and that death itself after a very short physical life (where the passage of linear time is an apparent component) is misleading? This passage of linear time may be more irrelevant than we realize and is not required in the development of who you truly are.
 
#86
I'm tempted to agree with you, in which case hypothesizing that existing forever would be a good thing is not based on any rational knowledge or model. However, without the passage of time, I would not be me. So to say that I might exist forever after I die is misleading.

~~ Paul
I don't see how we can say until we die, how would one know what - if anything - happens. Suggesting that one knows that something cannot be the case, seems just the same as insisting something must be the case.
 

Paul C. Anagnostopoulos

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Member
#87
Or perhaps you always have existed for eternity and that death itself after a very short physical life (where the passage of linear time is an apparent component) is misleading? This passage of linear time may be more irrelevant than we realize and is not required in the development of who you truly are.
That is possible, but then I do not know what "I might exist forever" means. The me that I know in this life? Some completely different me that this me wouldn't recognize? If the forever-me isn't sufficiently like me that I can identify myself when I'm the forever-me, then it isn't me that's living forever.

~~ Paul
 

Paul C. Anagnostopoulos

Nap, interrupted.
Member
#88
I don't see how we can say until we die, how would one know what - if anything - happens. Suggesting that one knows that something cannot be the case, seems just the same as insisting something must be the case.
I'm not saying that something like living forever is absolutely impossible. I'm just suspicious that it isn't "me" that would be living forever.

~~ Paul
 

Paul C. Anagnostopoulos

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#89
Paul if god is eternal Paul then by definition I could explore him eternally . I'm not imagining a long time , I'm imagining forever or eternally.
You could explore him eternally. I'm just suggesting that it would be a horrible experience. And if it is somehow eternally blissful, then it isn't "you" who is doing the exploring, but some completely different sort of being who has no sense of time. Like a rock.

~~ Paul
 
B

Baccarat

#90
You could explore him eternally. I'm just suggesting that it would be a horrible experience. And if it is somehow eternally blissful, then it isn't "you" who is doing the exploring, but some completely different sort of being who has no sense of time. Like a rock.
Any evidence for this claim?
 
#93
Yes, I know you are. But I have yet to hear how existing forever is going to be pleasant.

~~ Paul
If your identity is only your ego and persona's then of course eternity would seem bleak but if your consciousness expands and includes the whole universe with it's endless creativity then it would be a gas. If your present consciousness expanded in that way you may not lose the identity you are attached to but remember and integrate your past identities and endlessly continue to evolve/expand creatively and eternally. Perhaps a little ayahauska might help
 

Paul C. Anagnostopoulos

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Member
#94
If your identity is only your ego and persona's then of course eternity would seem bleak but if your consciousness expands and includes the whole universe with it's endless creativity then it would be a gas.
But then that's not really me anymore. In order to be me, my little localized consciousness still has to be paying attention.

If your present consciousness expanded in that way you may not lose the identity you are attached to but remember and integrate your past identities and endlessly continue to evolve/expand creatively and eternally. Perhaps a little ayahauska might help
This sounds good but I don't think the words really mean anything. I'd be more convinced if I thought ayahuasca experiences were necessarily anything like this proposed living forever thing.

~~ Paul
 
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