Chis Shelton, Social Science Blind Spot Regarding Cults? |444|

#41
Were you able to verify that these experiences were happening in consensus reality?
Marriage of "consensus reality" to an objective determination as to the fact of (or not) the 'actuality' of the source of a phenomenon may be a mistake and what keeps us within the general box most appear to be comfortably anchored. (See post #39)

Bingo, blaise, in your post, post #30.
 
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#42
I have done WILD before. I heard auditory hallucinations but they were clearly inside my head. In extension of that I had a sleep paralysis without hallucinations but the paralysis was frightening enough by itself. I discovered it by accident by meditating on the flashing lights when I closed my eyes.

A moving chair is not a hallucination. An invisible human shaped being passing through you is very convincing and I have hard time believing my nervous system arranged to form that hallucination.
I seen telekinesis so I hear you on the moving this albeit a person did it well atleast they claimed to
 
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#43
I have done WILD before. I heard auditory hallucinations but they were clearly inside my head. In extension of that I had a sleep paralysis without hallucinations but the paralysis was frightening enough by itself. I discovered it by accident by meditating on the flashing lights when I closed my eyes.

A moving chair is not a hallucination. An invisible human shaped being passing through you is very convincing and I have hard time believing my nervous system arranged to form that hallucination.
Well that was one of the questions I raised in my post. When people experience hypnopompic hallucinations upon waking up for a few seconds or even minutes (one person said his lasted an hour in comments) is it possible some people have a capacity to randomly trigger these states while being awake? There's not research on it, but it does raise the question.
My friend who is a licensed hypnotist told me that the hypnotist can control you. And when they say they can't it's bull, it's a secret kept between them. I asked because they always prefaced that you are the one controlling the state which is a half truth, they say they are only conductors, but my friend said this is bullcrap. If a hypnotist can make crowds hallucinate, imagine what you can do to yourself? We all possess these capabilities it's dormant in all of us I believe.

If you read one of the comments on the video I posted one person shared their experience of seeing a ghost of a composer floating above them and going through them.

This is all very fascinating, the thing with paranormal explanations is we are putting the carriage before the horse. We need more research on these topics
 
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#44
That's why I believe it's good to get grounded with your experiences and know you have options. Jumping straight to the paranormal can make people go crazy, regardless if it is religious, occult, new age etc. First start pragmatic, stay centered, research and be grounded. Don't jump around to all this paranormal stuff atleast not right away
 
#45
One thing. During a few years prior to the "wild" experiences there were periodic knockings from my wall. In hindsight I think these were related. I was absolutely sure it was physical and I even had the building architect around to see if he could figure out if there was a problem with the building.

Other people heard these knockings and we never found an explanation. Sometimes it would knock 24/7 and it was almost impossible to sleep.
I think I would call that pretty decent evidence that you did indeed encounter a poltergeist - i.e. something that entered consensus reality.
Other from that: even if we put a camera inside my apartment I am not sure anything other than the chair could have been picked up. There was an "invisible being". I was being touched and passed through by. I regularily walked in a nearby forest and sometimes I had experiences there as well. In other words the phenomena was following me. It was not restricted to my house (like a typical "ghost" would).

I have been pretty far out mentally due to my traumas so I really had to notice these phenomena if they could be hallucinations or something paranormal before I decided whether to contact a psychiatrist or a psychic person. I decided the latter and she learnt me to work with my inner traumas and repressed memories and gradually the phenomena disappeared. I think my sightings and auditory experiences might be able to be explained as a sort of hallucination but the invisible being I stumbled into. I can't see why my body should have that function built-in to create that illusion (since I am not the only person with these experiences).

Here is a psychic with her explanation of it, which fits very well with my experience and what the psychic person I visited told me to do:
https://www.crystalannecompton.com/poltergeists-what-they-are-and-how-to-clear-them/
Was this process completely successful - i.e. have all these phenomena stopped now - I am not sure how well I would have coped in a similar situation?

David
 
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#46
Interesting neitschze quote
Dream and culture. Memory is that function of the brain which is most greatly impaired by sleep--not that it relaxes entirely, but it is brought back to a state of imperfection, as it might have been in everyone, when awake and by day, during mankind's primeval age. Arbitrary and confused as it is, it continually mistakes things on the basis of the most superficial similarities; but it was the same arbitrariness and confusion with which the tribes composed their mythologies, and even now travelers regularly observe how greatly the savage inclines to forgetfulness, how, after he strains his memory briefly, his mind begins to stagger about, and he produces lies and nonsense simply because he is weary. But all of us are like the savage when we dream. Faulty recognitions and mistaken equations are the basis of the poor conclusions which we are guilty of making in dreams, so that when we recollect a dream clearly, we are frightened of ourselves, because we harbor so much foolishness within. The utter clarity of all dream-ideas, which presupposes an unconditional belief in their reality, reminds us once again of the state of earlier mankind in which hallucinations were extraordinarily frequent, and sometimes seized whole communities, whole nations simultaneously. Thus, in our sleep and dreams, we go through the work of earlier mankind once more. Human, All Too Human Of First and Last Things
 
#47
That's why I believe it's good to get grounded with your experiences and know you have options. Jumping straight to the paranormal can make people go crazy, regardless if it is religious, occult, new age etc. First start pragmatic, stay centered, research and be grounded. Don't jump around to all this paranormal stuff atleast not right away
The thing is even if you feel you are grounded once you start changing the lenses you see through, you change and there is no going back to the You who was grounded.
There arent any" in the know", we are all just fools bumbling around in the dark.... but the power you do have is to make the choice to enjoy the ride or not to.
 
#48
When I was practicing Integral Yoga (late, great Swami Satchidananda), I used to visit a group of yogis who lived together in this very old house. The swami in charge there had this wonderful Irish tenor voice & led the chants that were simply beautiful. One time I visited & he had a cold & couldn't use his voice well. I thought to myself, "I wish I could rid him of that cold so he could chant!!" A few minutes later, as I walked into the kitchen, a very bright, tiny spot of light swept into the room & flew into me. The next day, I had a sore throat & that swami I mentioned felt 100% better!
Another visit, different experience. I hadn't planned to spend the night, but the yogis talked me into staying over for another day. I had to sleep on the dining room floor right next to the kitchen doorway. I am lying there & I distinctly heard someone walking around in the kitchen, so I decided to see who was up & stood up & flipped on the light. Nobody there! So, I lay back down & in a few minutes, that same pacing sound began again. I jumped up quickly & flipped on the light & still, no one! There was a kitchen table, but no room to hide there b/c of chairs & there were no other spaces for hiding. The kitchen door to the back bedrooms was closed, just like the first time I checked. Then I decided the guys were playing w/ me, so I hunched down by the doorway, ready to spring up & catch them this time. Sure enough, that pacing started again & I launched myself up & slapped the light on, but still, NO ONE! After that, the walking sound stopped. The next morning, I told the yogis about my experience & they said it was probably that old ghost of a farmer that they'd see sometimes, standing in the doorway in his overalls & watching them.
 

Alex

Administrator
#49
Hi Alex
Try "Trance from magic to Technology"by Dennis Wier, its his hypothesis on how trance is formed, if the hypothesis is right or not isnt too
important to me just little gems here and there.another one is by a stage musician who wrote on his travels to India in the colonial days
some of the magic shows he observed required and used whole crowd trance and collective hallucination to work, the thing is if its possible to do a crowd how can we trust anything that is happening around as at all, "Hypnotism and Mysticism of India" Ormond McGill.
nice. thx.
 

Alex

Administrator
#50
When I was practicing Integral Yoga (late, great Swami Satchidananda), I used to visit a group of yogis who lived together in this very old house. The swami in charge there had this wonderful Irish tenor voice & led the chants that were simply beautiful. One time I visited & he had a cold & couldn't use his voice well. I thought to myself, "I wish I could rid him of that cold so he could chant!!" A few minutes later, as I walked into the kitchen, a very bright, tiny spot of light swept into the room & flew into me. The next day, I had a sore throat & that swami I mentioned felt 100% better!
Another visit, different experience. I hadn't planned to spend the night, but the yogis talked me into staying over for another day. I had to sleep on the dining room floor right next to the kitchen doorway. I am lying there & I distinctly heard someone walking around in the kitchen, so I decided to see who was up & stood up & flipped on the light. Nobody there! So, I lay back down & in a few minutes, that same pacing sound began again. I jumped up quickly & flipped on the light & still, no one! There was a kitchen table, but no room to hide there b/c of chairs & there were no other spaces for hiding. The kitchen door to the back bedrooms was closed, just like the first time I checked. Then I decided the guys were playing w/ me, so I hunched down by the doorway, ready to spring up & catch them this time. Sure enough, that pacing started again & I launched myself up & slapped the light on, but still, NO ONE! After that, the walking sound stopped. The next morning, I told the yogis about my experience & they said it was probably that old ghost of a farmer that they'd see sometimes, standing in the doorway in his overalls & watching them.
wow... thx. what's yr take on the farmer ghost thing?
 

Alex

Administrator
#51
I have done WILD before. I heard auditory hallucinations but they were clearly inside my head. In extension of that I had a sleep paralysis without hallucinations but the paralysis was frightening enough by itself. I discovered it by accident by meditating on the flashing lights when I closed my eyes.

A moving chair is not a hallucination. An invisible human shaped being passing through you is very convincing and I have hard time believing my nervous system arranged to form that hallucination.
i'd be interested to hear what do you make of:
https://thegodabovegod.com/archonic-mind-parasites/
 
#53
hey Chris... not sure what you mean?
Thanks for the reply. I sent an email a few minutes previous to then with the subject: On Chris Shelton's backing away from conscious source

It has potentially "triggering" comments/opinion and I wanted it moderated by someone other than myself (1) and (2) more appropreately by the forum owner.
Sometimes I do not realize how much my words hurt (not that they are of any power by just crass or unthinking).
So, if you reply to that email, we can go from there on it.

Sorry. Long winded answer, but to cover it fully I feel this is ok. Someone commented on me being cryptic - certainly not intentional - so this is longer winded than a usual. But still cryptic because the content of the email is not here... nothing I'm gonna do about that in this post.
 
#54
Wow, what an interview. I understand Chris’s aggressive response when (you) Alex, wanted to “expand” his horizons with remote viewing or any other kind of (what is considered) voodoo beliefs.

Don’t get me wrong, I actually know “remote viewing” works. I’ve done it with a few friends who were totally shaken because we actually saw exact names, places & the situation that happened months later in a totally unrelated situation. In short people we didn’t know before, locations we’d never been to all the way to the odd vehicle we were in. Purple velvet inside w/green fringe. So, it’s not like that happens every day. I won't get into details, it would take too long. I’m not interested in doing remote viewing, because it is so draining. It (for me) is also random. When you see future events, it’s like you have just walked into the middle of the movie & have no idea what is going on. I think (maybe) if you wanted to actually work at it, you might be able to hone this skill, but for me...eh, it gives me a headache. If I had to find a missing child then I might consider doing it. The last time I did, it was for Adam Walsh.

In short, many gates were closed to me, as I kept pushing them open (mentally) refusing to be stopped, a voice told me, what I’d see would change me as it was from the darkest, deepest place. I knew he was dead. I stopped & never went back. A week later they did find his body, but I couldn’t tell anyone except my husband & cry. Because we knew if I called the police, they’d think I had something to do with it or not listen, plus, since I didn’t want to continue (since I knew at that point he was dead/and not a good death) I didn’t know exactly where the body was.

OKAY, that said. I totally get Chris. I was brought up in a very Christian home (Sunday school/singing in the choir). Something never sat right with me with everyone going to hell, and didn’t Adam & Eve have to have sex with their kids to populate the world. I mean I had a LOT of questions, that eh, it just didn’t add up. BUT, like Chris, we are taught early to question meant the DEVIL was trying to get into us! Terrifying thought. It took me years (guess I was about 25) when I finally looked up at the sky & said okay if you’re there, you’re going to have to show me something. My problem was, even if you follow all the Bible (like I was taught) you had to agree w/burning people in the fire for all eternity because they didn’t BELIEVE like me? I don’t know. THAT’S not fair. So, I figured man must have messed up a book (Bible) people started talking FOR God & I decided (cause I do know the Bible) that Jesus said, we don’t have to go through a church or anyone to speak w/God. NOW THAT sounded logical to me. So the entire church thing was out.

Which brings me to Scientology. My friends took me to one of their (not sure what you call it) but you fill out that questionnaire. OH BROTHER! Some of the questions were so stupid. Did I find myself just happy, walking along and maybe singing to myself or whistling? Yep, that’s me! The questions were like they were trying to decide if I was weak or self-assured. I tend to be kind of self-assured & not real into having people mess with my mind. So, they had me sit down with some weird woman who kept gazing into my eyes (unblinking). I was amused. She didn’t like that. I can hold a staring contest (which I attempted) but I think she had some incense in the room or something, so I had to look away & blink. WHY CAN’T YOU HOLD EYES DIRECTLY LOOKING AT ME!? She demanded. I told her it was rude to stare. Yeah, I wasn’t going to fit in, regardless of the pretty boys she had hanging around.

Poor Chris dragged into this nonsense (like me w/fundamentalist). After seeing all the Catholic Church AND Scientology have been doing. I think BOTH should be put down. Totally put OUT of business. They are not a religion, they are sick, wicked, indoctrination camps (or cults as you said). But so damaging. I’m not sure which is worse. I’m pretty angry with the Catholics & their pedophile priest (at the highest levels). Good God, Catholics, just quit already. You don’t need a church, you can pray to God without giving $$ to such horrible organizations that twist young minds, defile people & completely destroy families.

Now Chris, that said...being an atheist is not the answer. Doing the opposite of something doesn’t make it right either. It’s like adults who got whipped turn around & don’t discipline their kids. The answer is somewhere in the middle or on the edges. I’m still listening to the program again. I LOVED that Chris stood up to you Alex. And, you know I love you Alex. But, it showed me he could do it. He COULD in fact say HELL to the no. Show me the money I get it. And Alex, it’s going to be really hard to “show them the money” because we can’t give them the winning numbers to the lottery, or the headlines on May 25, 2020.

Yes, Alex, I have heard & read for years about remote viewing, near-death... but for someone like Chris who wants real evidence. UFOs? We can’t have them appear on demand. So Chris will have to see it himself NEVER again will he be just “told” what to believe. He did that long enough & got burned. It is more healthy for him (or anyone) to NOT just accept what someone says or a master manipulators schemes. My God they call me almost daily wanting my credit card numbers or the IRS is going to drag me off to jail (as if).

Someone needs to point out that a lot of these “mind-bending” groups get kids new to college. They know no one and are away for the first time. Groups do “love bombing” & THAT is how they get college kids. Look at Charles Manson or the Moonies.... that is what they did. Lonely kids.

GREAT SHOW ALEX!
 
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#55
I think atheism is the perfect position, it just doesn't have to be dogmatic. Being open minded curious, and cross reference research.
 
#57
I think atheism is the perfect position, it just doesn't have to be dogmatic. Being open minded curious, and cross reference research.
*****
There is no such thing as an "atheist". An atheist thinks there is no God. Prove it. You can't. You can be agnostic. Understand the meanings of words.
 
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#58
*****
There is no such thing as an "atheist". An atheist thinks there is no God. Prove it. You can't. You can be agnostic. Understand the meanings of words.
Maybe the new definition is, which is really narrow. Carl Sagan was an atheist, but "open minded" its just wording. It's been hijacked by the new atheist pseudo intellectuals. Agnostic is fine, but I don't care about "god" I'm interested in nature. People find it hard to conceptualize a universe with out God, it's really not that hard
 
#59
I think atheism is the perfect position, it just doesn't have to be dogmatic. Being open minded curious, and cross reference research.
Im not sure a critical/logical thinker could ever be an atheist,an agnostic yes, but never an atheist, thats like a full stop on a sentence and its all over then.
 

Alex

Administrator
#60
After seeing all the Catholic Church AND Scientology have been doing. I think BOTH should be put down. Totally put OUT of business.
totally agree. I don't think this is as impossible as it seems. we established and enforce standards of moral responsibility in criminal culpability all the time, why can't we do it in this area. maybe the answer is more conspiratorial :)
 
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