Coronavirus Pandemic

I don't understand how it doesn't give you the heebie jeebies to think of altering ones DNA due to 'progress'.

Being scared of progress and technology that has affected the external world is one thing. Something that alters the very fabric of our physical selves, is a whole different ball game.....
It does give me the heebies. But I'm not sure this is anything more than a step on the ladder. Feels like we've been likely impacting our own DNA for eons; perhaps since the industrial revolution. We have exercised discretion over our evolution as a species before. Sure, this is the most direct, most intimate method yet, but I don't see any scenario where we aren't making such modifications in, say, 100 years.

My point was to ask if this is categorically something to be against or opposed to. I don't think its a categorical thing; that DNA modification should be off limits to humans. We certainly haven't stopped progress when previous seemingly sacred cows were in the road.

No. To me, I don't get how you can go through life just accepting things like altering DNA or the effects of a so called Pandemic on the world economically, or the threat of the elite, as if it's non-consequential and meaningless. It's as if you have no self or inner drive to stop the environment/world/those in power, from wanting to change your reality. That is why I think you are a like a leaf that gets blown about in the wind. You always pose questions from a point of view that seems completely detached from what is happening in the world. I just don't get it. And fair enough, that's your perspective, but it doesn't make any sense to me.
This is perhaps the issue DD: I don't see anyone wanting to force a changed reality on me. I do see us floundering about with COVID, with Trump, with a whole host of things. But I don't see some dystopian master plan being implemented by the "elites" as you put it that seeks to subjugate my current state of being. If you take this part out of your own worldview for a second, I wouldn't likely seem of a different mind to you.
 
It does give me the heebies. But I'm not sure this is anything more than a step on the ladder. Feels like we've been likely impacting our own DNA for eons; perhaps since the industrial revolution. We have exercised discretion over our evolution as a species before. Sure, this is the most direct, most intimate method yet, but I don't see any scenario where we aren't making such modifications in, say, 100 years.

Which is exactly why I say you just accept whatever is presented to you in the form of progress.


Silence said:
This is perhaps the issue DD: I don't see anyone wanting to force a changed reality on me. I do see us floundering about with COVID, with Trump, with a whole host of things. But I don't see some dystopian master plan being implemented by the "elites" as you put it that seeks to subjugate my current state of being. If you take this part out of your own worldview for a second, I wouldn't likely seem of a different mind to you.

And this is exactly why I disagree.
 
It does give me the heebies. But I'm not sure this is anything more than a step on the ladder. Feels like we've been likely impacting our own DNA for eons; perhaps since the industrial revolution. We have exercised discretion over our evolution as a species before. Sure, this is the most direct, most intimate method yet, but I don't see any scenario where we aren't making such modifications in, say, 100 years.

My point was to ask if this is categorically something to be against or opposed to. I don't think its a categorical thing; that DNA modification should be off limits to humans. We certainly haven't stopped progress when previous seemingly sacred cows were in the road.


This is perhaps the issue DD: I don't see anyone wanting to force a changed reality on me. I do see us floundering about with COVID, with Trump, with a whole host of things. But I don't see some dystopian master plan being implemented by the "elites" as you put it that seeks to subjugate my current state of being. If you take this part out of your own worldview for a second, I wouldn't likely seem of a different mind to you.

The master plan isn’t dystopian to the elites. It’s dystopian to the lower classes. It’s utopian to the upper classes
 
As are most dystopias, real and fictional.
I’m not ready to quantify “dystopia”. I don’t understand what you mean by “most dystopias...real and fictional”. Are you saying that people who believe there is an oligarchic class that uses their labor/life force in an inequitable manner are paranoid and buying into a fictional narrative?
 
Which is exactly why I say you just accept whatever is presented to you in the form of progress.




And this is exactly why I disagree.

Diver,
Maybe Silence isn't Caucasian. As a Caucasian I am told by the left that I am a racist and I am privileged and it's time for me to pay for that.

Heck, I'm so racist I might not even know it. It's unconscious biases and systemic. Only the enlightened technocrats know my very thoughts better than I do.

If that's not forcing a reality change on me, I don't know what is.
\
Some people are making like ostriches as an excuse to not fight back - AKA moral and physical cowardice.
 
Diver,
Maybe Silence isn't Caucasian. As a Caucasian I am told by the left that I am a racist and I am privileged and it's time for me to pay for that.

Heck, I'm so racist I might not even know it. It's unconscious biases and systemic. Only the enlightened technocrats know my very thoughts better than I do.

If that's not forcing a reality change on me, I don't know what is.
\
Some people are making like ostriches as an excuse to not fight back - AKA moral and physical cowardice.
Here we go... The tragic middle aged, middle-class(?) white guy complaining that nothing ever goes his way.

I’m not saying that the woke brigade can’t be pathetic, but the pushback often looks just as daft.
 
Here we go... The tragic middle aged, middle-class(?) white guy complaining that nothing ever goes his way.

I’m not saying that the woke brigade can’t be pathetic, but the pushback often looks just as daft.

You're completely misrepresenting what I said. I used an example. It touched a nerve. Maybe you are a lazy ass over- melaninned perpetual victim/whiner after all.

My point is that technocrats want to tell us how we really think and take corrective action in our lives because they know better than we do right down to our very thoughts. It doesn't matter the topic/issue.

Try to follow the bouncing ball. Try to understand concepts instead of becoming hyper-focussed on detail of examples, like an autistic dork.
 
What we need to focus on is the coming mRNA vaccine, this has the potential to be one of the biggest iatrogenic (caused by the physician) mass poisoning epidemics in history, because this is going to be universal (starting with the UK, the Pfizer vaccine of course, and also Russia with their Sputnik V vaccine), and when it comes to mRNA vaccines, this is untried and untested outside of research trials. This kind of untested on a large scale vaccine tech has been in the works for about 20 years, but this is the first time it is going to be unleashed in a significant way, near everywhere on the globe (certainly in the West). Given this widespread universal vaccination campaign, unprecedented in history, given that we don't know what long-term effects mRNA vaccine tech is going to have on our genomes, given that they are going to give this to the vulnerable elderly demographic, given the long dark history of vaccines, we could be on the brink of some huge medical disaster. A case of the cure being worse than the phantom pandemic. There was an initiative to provide mRNA vaccines during the SARS and MERS reputed epidemics, but there were side-effects, an excessive autoimmune response, attacking the lung tissue of vaccinated animals (and SARS and MERS went away). The new Pfizer vaccine and Moderna vaccine apparently have tweaked out such bugs. But there are other problems, aside from the fact that no COVID-19 vaccine is necessary at all, just like all useless and toxic vaccines.

Too little is known about genetics and the human genome, new discoveries are made all the time, and in the 21st century these new discoveries, notably re pseudogenes, MGEs, the biomechanics of the eukaryotic nucleus, SINEs, LINEs, genetic regulation, gene expression etc., also enzymology and cellular biology as a whole, means that we know even less than we thought we did twenty years ago. The paradox of scientific advance is that the further we go the less we know, the more mysteries are revealed and more interconnectivity, more complexity, in multiple ways. Short of it is we don't know what effects mRNA vaccines will have on our genomes. We know too little. And also Big Pharma could care less. As their gangster history reveals. Gene Therapy has not panned out as well as the scientists have hoped, in fact not at all really (aside from a few claims of success here and there), despite a lot of hype. There have been a number of health disasters there (not just the infamous case of Jesse Gelsinger); and this is related to the whole mRNA vaccine thing because we are talking about a kind of gene therapy if you think about it (mRNA tech being injected into our bloodstream). In other words, we are dealing with so many unknowns here, and they want to vaccinate literally millions of youngsters across the globe with this unknown quantity, even as youngsters are not coming down with the flu/pneumonia (which is what we mean when we talk about COVID-19, in reality) at any higher rates and numbers than any other year, that is very very rarely; even as their schools, kindergardens and universities are shut and have been shut in many places, and they are wearing masks and social distancing etc. Never mind the rest of us. That would include the elderly who are already vulnerable, with vulnerable immune systems, because they are uh elderly.

Concerns with the Pfizer mRNA vaccine include as always the preservatives and their potential effects on our bodies, in this case potassium chloride and polyethylene glycol notably, aside from the who-knows-what-this-is-going-to-do mRNA. Michael Yeadon a former VP at Pfizer (he quit in 2011) and head of their allergy and respiratory division back in the day, is speaking out against this Pfizer vaccine (and so he is being attacked by the usual suspects). Here is what he says (somebody may have brought this up on this thread, I haven't read through all the posts here). I take it from here https://evolvetoecology.org/2020/12...-suspension-of-all-sars-cov2-vaccine-studies/


  • The formation of so-called “non-neutralizing antibodies” can lead to an exaggerated immune reaction, especially when the test person is confronted with the real, “wild” virus after vaccination. This so-called antibody-dependent amplification, ADE, has long been known from experiments with corona vaccines in cats, for example. In the course of these studies all cats that initially tolerated the vaccination well died after catching the wild virus.
  • The vaccinations are expected to produce antibodies against spike proteins of SARS-CoV-2. However, spike proteins also contain syncytin-homologous proteins, which are essential for the formation of the placenta in mammals such as humans. It must be absolutely ruled out that a vaccine against SARS-CoV-2 could trigger an immune reaction against syncytin-1, as otherwise infertility of indefinite duration could result in vaccinated women.
  • The mRNA vaccines from BioNTech/Pfizer contain polyethylene glycol (PEG). 70% of people develop antibodies against this substance – this means that many people can develop allergic, potentially fatal reactions to the vaccination.
  • The much too short duration of the study does not allow a realistic estimation of the late effects. As in the narcolepsy cases after the swine flu vaccination, millions of healthy people would be exposed to an unacceptable risk if an emergency approval were to be granted and the possibility of observing the late effects of the vaccination were to follow. Nevertheless, BioNTech/Pfizer apparently submitted an application for emergency approval on December 1, 2020.


Let me emphasize, a real risk here is potential female infertility. Young women take note.

Note the swine flu vaccine disaster referred to is the one in 2009/2010 in Sweden (resulting in a huge settlement), not the massive '76 swine flu vaccine disaster in the US, in which hundreds were left paralyzed (Guillain-Barre Syndrome) and dozens died (namely elderly). The US govt settled to the tune of half a billion dollars - in 1976. And this full-speed ahead with the Pfizer vaccine and COVID-19 vaccines in general reminds one of then US president Gerald Ford with his full-speed ahead with the swine flu vaccine. In the midst of the non-existent swine flu pandemic of 1976 (one soldier died at Fort Dix, that was it) in the USA. And now we have even a far bigger outbreak of mass hysteria, the biggest in history. It's global this time thanks to the global village. In 1976 there was no Internet, no social media and no smart phones.
https://www.discovermagazine.com/health/the-public-health-legacy-of-the-1976-swine-flu-outbreak

Gerald Ford got his vaccine (see the link), reminds one of Obama, Bush, Clinton, saying yeah they will get the covid vaccine. Note all these former presidents are old enough to remember the '76 swine flu vaccine disaster. But like lots of people old enough, they have the memories of goldfish, if they even paid attention at the time. It's different this time! This time we have a completely unknown quantity, mRNA vaccine tech! Hey it's 2020. Pfizer and co know what they are doing, just ask them. And their shareholders.
 
I thought Kawasaki Disease was "An addiction to riding motorcycles at high speed every Saturday".

Turns out, it's not.

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https://www.fda.gov/media/143557/download

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Let's peel back the onion one layer. Who all in is on the caper to poison, sterilize, maim, and kill millions? I'm assuming, for example. that the front line health care workers are NOT "in on the gag" so to speak.
They don’t have to be. In fact, it’s beneficial to make martyrs of them. There is a new generation of medicine being ushered in. The skills that most of the “front line workers” have learned will be mostly obsolete.
 
"There are currently no licensed mRNA vaccines in the United States."
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mrna.html

When implementing a new technology, is it good to start with injecting millions of people? What are the risks for the recipient?

"ACTIVE CASES
19,455,859
Currently Infected Patients
19,349,763 (99.5%) in Mild Condition
106,096 (0.5%) Serious or Critical"
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

99.5% of current cases are currently mild, what is the risk vs reward of the vaccine?

Where I live, 69% of Covid related deaths are in people ages 80 to 90.
87% aged 70 or older.
For those under 20, there have been zero deaths.
https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/provinces/ontario (on the graph, click on deaths)

What is an acceptable level of risk for a person under 20 to take a new form of vaccine?

"The World Health Organization has warned against issuing “immunity passports” to people who have recovered from Covid-19, as there is no evidence that they will be protected from a second infection. "
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/25/who-warns-against-coronavirus-immunity-passports

So our natural immune systems do not convey immunity after having the live virus, but a new form of vaccine never widely used before will convey immunity? For how long? How many vaccine shots do you have to get?
 
They don’t have to be. In fact, it’s beneficial to make martyrs of them. There is a new generation of medicine being ushered in. The skills that most of the “front line workers” have learned will be mostly obsolete.
Ah, okay. That makes sense.
 
@stripedcatfrommars

Are you able to elucidate what exactly an mRNA vaccine is? I mean, as I understand it, mRNA is created from the corresponding section of DNA, and leaves the nucleus to pass on the message to a ribosome to make protein.

However, mRNA is soon destroyed, and so I don't understand how any permanent change is made to confer immunity over time.

David
 
mRNA is created from the corresponding section of DNA, and leaves the nucleus to pass on the message to a ribosome to make protein.

I don't think the artificial mRNA crosses in or out of the nucleus.

I also don't understand how it could confer immunity without doing that, other than via periodic "booster" shots.
 
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