David Ditchfield’s Near-Death Experience Turned Him Into an Artist and Composer |453|

[David Bailey]

It actually was written not too long after his death compared to most ancient writings. We can't be positive about the facts of his life but sometimes the standard of proof for his existence is treated differently than other historical figures. Most historians have come to conclude that his existence is pretty much a fact. It's extremely more likely than not.

The thing about other historical figures - Julius Caesar for example, is that they rose to the top in their time, and there is a lot of impartial material (i.e. stuff that isn't laden with religious significance) that historians can use to piece together their lives. Maybe it is better to compare Jesus with someone like Robin Hood (I hope he is known on your side of the pond). If he lived as described, he was an anti-establishment figure who famously robbed from the rich and gave to the poor. He may have been a real person, or just a legend. It is probably impossible to disentangle the truth now because he did not achieve high office.

David

 

[Dmitch]

In Grant Cameron's interview he kept repeating consciousness comes first and forms the foundation of reality. I've followed Cameron through the years and was struck by his new way of framing the ET debate. Cameron obviously had some sort of epiphany and was coming from a different direction but one of the commonalities of NDEs is that everything melts into consciousness beyond physical experience. In other words "Everything is consciousness."

NDEs also assert the underlying fabric of consciousness is universal love. Love is the expression of both content and context of non dual existence. One could say this is embodied in Christ Consciousness.

Here is David Ditchfield an average sort of bloke caught up in the muck of life and almost dies a horrible death but doesn't. He writes a book and relates his NDE as his intellect can best articulate it. It obviously has completely changed his life and Alex is trying to tease out the essence of the experience sans Ditchfield's prior belief systems.

However, I don't think you can do that. Its a mistake to assert historical Jesus doesn't exist so some aspect of his experience is not completely valid. Does Jesus exist is like asking does Christ Consciousness exist. Our brains are built to understand through symbolic representations. We apparently arrive on the other side with physically derived perceptions intact. Steve Briggs takes these spiritual figures to be a human archetype question. They seem to exist as a manifestation of the human collective consciousness.

I'll just say we dont know, we cant know the historical Jesus but somehow these archetype figures are appearing in NDEs and fully interactive as talking, loving, joking, instructive figures. Be they Blue Krishna or Mohammed or even Archangel Gabriel. Its all happening in consciousness and IMO one can't stack one reality as more true then another. Alex may have a fuller intellectual grasp of the whole scheme then Ditchfield or myself but will it render an NDE without Jesus? I wouldn't bet on it.

With utmost respect for David Ditchfield I submit another short length PDF of Mellon-Thomas Benedict. This narrative has a larger, expansive perspective. I'll attach the PDF and underneath his web site. I dont mean to distract from Ditchfield's interview but this thread is following a familiar theme.
https://ndestories.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/MellensStoryReadByMellen.pdf

https://ndestories.org/mellen-thomas-benedict/

 

[Chris7]

The thing about other historical figures - Julius Caesar for example, is that they rose to the top in their time, and there is a lot of impartial material (i.e. stuff that isn't laden with religious significance) that historians can use to piece together their lives. Maybe it is better to compare Jesus with someone like Robin Hood (I hope he is known on your side of the pond). If he lived as described, he was an anti-establishment figure who famously robbed from the rich and gave to the poor. He may have been a real person, or just a legend. It is probably impossible to disentangle the truth now because he did not achieve high office.

David

There are impartial sources as well...Josephus and Tacitus. The Bible is actually a good historical source...at least in terms of his existence, along with the other historians. Paul mentions him as well and he would have known Jesus' closest followers.

 

[jtcelts]

I would say he's the typical left wing atheist type ; his arguments are easy to rip to shreds. I bet he's a worshiper of Global warming and the rest of that bunk, socialist type. I love arguing with these types, very easy to get them angry and throw them off there arguments.

 

[David Bailey]

I would say he's the typical left wing atheist type ; his arguments are easy to rip to shreds. I bet he's a worshiper of Global warming and the rest of that bunk, socialist type. I love arguing with these types, very easy to get them angry and throw them off there arguments.

I can't tell who you are talking about (me???) because you didn't quote anyone.

However, I think you need to take people's ideas one by one - not group them as you have done.

For example, I am not a Christian, nor do I belong to any other religion (so some people would call me an atheist), on the other hand,
I am near certain that there is a spirit/non-material world (whatever you like to call it) , I don't believe in Global Warming, and I am one of those who hope that the President will get a second term (though I am British).

David

 

[jtcelts]

Trump will win in a landslide almost, don't believe all those fake news polls . The communists and socialists shall be destroyed and sent to hell where they belong ,evil as they are and anybody who supports this. Talk about Evil , this is the Democratic Party of the USA!

 

[jtcelts]

I can't tell who you are talking about (me???) because you didn't quote anyone.

However, I think you need to take people's ideas one by one - not group them as you have done.

For example, I am not a Christian, nor do I belong to any other religion (so some people would call me an atheist), on the other hand,
I am near certain that there is a spirit/non-material world (whatever you like to call it) , I don't believe in Global Warming, and I am one of those who hope that the President will get a second term (though I am British).

David

I can't tell who you are talking about (me???) because you didn't quote anyone.

However, I think you need to take people's ideas one by one - not group them as you have done.

For example, I am not a Christian, nor do I belong to any other religion (so some people would call me an atheist), on the other hand,
I am near certain that there is a spirit/non-material world (whatever you like to call it) , I don't believe in Global Warming, and I am one of those who hope that the President will get a second term (though I am British).

David

You're a good and smart person, always vote Torry!!!! is that correct spelling ?The Muslim Mayor of London is a complete POS. I love London, best city in the world!, but needs a change though. I live near near Annapolis MD , very haunted city by the way., Funny , on this site, I never hear this Buffoon Alex on here criticize say Islam or Judaisms per say.

 

[jtcelts]

You're a good and smart person, always vote Torry!!!! is that correct spelling ?The Muslim Mayor of London is a complete POS. I love London, best city in the world!, but needs a change though. I live near near Annapolis MD , very haunted city by the way., Funny , on this site, I never hear this Buffoon Alex on here criticize say Islam or the Hebrew religion per say.

 

[Enrique Vargas]

You're a good and smart person, always vote Torry!!!! is that correct spelling ?The Muslim Mayor of London is a complete POS. I love London, best city in the world!, but needs a change though. I live near near Annapolis MD , very haunted city by the way., Funny , on this site, I never hear this Buffoon Alex on here criticize say Islam or Judaisms per say.

I share your political views; I was born in the USSR and have lived communist slavery in person. However, I take issue with you calling Alex a buffoon; he is a brilliant, intelligent and honest man who is sincerely trying to get to the truth of it all. I don't know what his politics are and I don't care. I'm aware of his vehement anti-Christian views, and although being a Christian, I don't get offended. It's between him and his Creator. I follow Alex for God knows how many years, and I'm grateful to him for the wealth of incredibly interesting interviews he shared with us. As any other human, he has his own phobias and idiosyncrasies, but certainly it doesn't warrant calling this outstanding person a "buffoon".

 

[David Bailey]

ou're a good and smart person, always vote Torry!!!! is that correct spelling ?The Muslim Mayor of London is a complete POS. I love London, best city in the world!, but needs a change though. I live near near Annapolis MD , very haunted city by the way., Funny , on this site, I never hear this Buffoon Alex on here criticize say Islam or Judaisms per say.

The word is Tory.

Despite your compliment, I am very close to banning you. This isn't a forum for this kind of vague talk, and is totally off-topic in a thread devoted to a particularly interesting example of an NDE.

Please stay off politics except in a thread such as "Trump Consciousness" - which is devoted to such issues.

David

 

[Alex]

Its a mistake to assert historical Jesus doesn't exist so some aspect of his experience is not completely valid. Does Jesus exist is like asking does Christ Consciousness exist.

this reminds me of Don Hoffman's point about "the language of God is silence, all else is a poor translation"... and while he can accept the wisdom of that it never seems to stop sage-on-the-stage religious folks from talking

so in this case, sure, it's all consciousness it's all God, it's all love.

so either shut up about your experience/research/revelations, or paraphrasing Hoffman, if we're going to talk, if we're going to have a dialogue, if we're going to try to understand, let's try and be precise as possible.

 

[Alex]

There are impartial sources as well...Josephus and Tacitus. The Bible is actually a good historical source...at least in terms of his existence, along with the other historians. Paul mentions him as well and he would have known Jesus' closest followers.

did you ever listen to:
Did Jesus Exist? Joseph Atwill Vs. Steven Crowder ... - Skeptiko

 

[jtcelts]

The word is Tory.

Despite your compliment, I am very close to banning you. This isn't a forum for this kind of vague talk, and is totally off-topic in a thread devoted to a particularly interesting example of an NDE.

Please stay off politics except in a thread such as "Trump Consciousness" - which is devoted to such issues.

David

You can go a head and ban me chief if you want!! lol I see other people taking politics on here. I got about 8 alerts in my mail box, so better ban them too!

 

[jtcelts]

The word is Tory.

Despite your compliment, I am very close to banning you. This isn't a forum for this kind of vague talk, and is totally off-topic in a thread devoted to a particularly interesting example of an NDE.

Please stay off politics except in a thread such as "Trump Consciousness" - which is devoted to such issues.

David

David, I beleiove you kind of started th epolical stuff

The word is Tory.

Despite your compliment, I am very close to banning you. This isn't a forum for this kind of vague talk, and is totally off-topic in a thread devoted to a particularly interesting example of an NDE.

Please stay off politics except in a thread such as "Trump Consciousness" - which is devoted to such issues.

David

I share your political views; I was born in the USSR and have lived communist slavery in person. However, I take issue with you calling Alex a buffoon; he is a brilliant, intelligent and honest man who is sincerely trying to get to the truth of it all. I don't know what his politics are and I don't care. I'm aware of his vehement anti-Christian views, and although being a Christian, I don't get offended. It's between him and his Creator. I follow Alex for God knows how many years, and I'm grateful to him for the wealth of incredibly interesting interviews he shared with us. As any other human, he has his own phobias and idiosyncrasies, but certainly it doesn't warrant calling this outstanding person a "buffoon".

I would say this , I don't see Brilliant in someone who makes baseless accusations and snide remarks about something he seems to know nothing about in a intellectual sense or historically. Someones baseless bias is not Brilliant; its the opposite, stupid! Put up the facts on your opinion like i did ; don't just say Jesus was never a person and all the Christianity is a myth and stupid, that's just plain hate and bias, not BRILLIANT.

I also never hear old Alex talk smack about the Muslim faith even the Hebrew faith Yea lets hear him say that abut Islam ! Lets hear about that!

 

[David Bailey]

You can go a head and ban me chief if you want!! lol I see other people taking politics on here. I got about 8 alerts in my mail box, so better ban them too!

Thanks for your permission - I have done just that.

David

 

[Kim]

Another excellent podcast! I am proud of myself for sticking w/ these sometimes excruciating painful discussions about the problem of evil & its existence. I have read a lot of NDE accounts, but never recall one that supported my perception that I had one, though it was very brief (30 - 45 seconds). To summarize, I suffered 2 fractured cervical & 2 thoracic vetebrae due to diving from a boat into a murky lake w/ which I was unfamiliar. I was suddenly aware that the sun shining through my eyelids as I lay in the boat's bottom after being pulled from the water had shifted to blindingly bright white instead of muted yellow. I was then aware of 3 entities or presences to my right; I was told in a non-verbal way to "go back. You're going to be fine." The light was back to muted yellow. I guess I really should do some research & see how common 3 helpful spirits are in NDEs. I agree w/ Dr. Raymond Moody, who has said that he never gets tired of hearing about or reading NDE accounts. There is so much there to be learned if you keep an open mind!

 

[Alex]

I also never hear old Alex talk smack about the Muslim faith even the Hebrew faith Yea lets hear him say that abut Islam ! Lets hear about that!

fair point. especially about Judaism... I mean, a lot of people have exposed the wacky the Islamic cult thing, but Judaism somehow gets a pass... I don't think it should.

 

[Alex]

I agree w/ Dr. Raymond Moody, who has said that he never gets tired of hearing about or reading NDE accounts.

thx for sharing yr story.

I love the Moody quote... very deep when you think about it. I've taken to trying to watch/ listen to/ read one miracle story everyday:

 

[Kim]

Thanks, Alex, for the Santa Knows Everything - It's a Miracle. It's just like Ur podcasts point out so often. Look to the Light & everything will be fine! This is the very thing that Ur podcasts bring out so powerfully: that we can be all these people who seem dead-set on working out their problems on Earth or we can turn to the LIght!

 

[Kim]

fair point. especially about Judaism... I mean, a lot of people have exposed the wacky the Islamic cult thing, but Judaism somehow gets a pass... I don't think it should.

I have little experience w/ Jewish people; you can probably imagine there are not many in Texas where I spent most of my working life. I did, however, work w/ a Jewess math teacher who was unfailingly kind & helpful to me; the thing I learned from her was that Jews don't believe in Hell, which backs up the fact that the Christian Hell came along w/ J.C. in the New Testament. They, unfortunately, have their own trouble w/ child molester rabbis & revolting rituals like circumcision that involve the rabbis taking the child's penis in his mouth for no apparent reason other than "It's okay, I'm a spiritual leader & it's part of the ritual." Some orthodox Jewish sects strongly encourage daily prayers of thankfulness for being born a man & require married couples to perform intercourse through a hole in a bed sheet. These fun facts & more are from Hitchen's God is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything, a great book that really grinds down organized religion.