Doubts about the moon landings

I haven't read on this thread the following theory: That the landings actually occurred and that there was an effort to create the "fake landing" scenario just in case the real missions failed. This was done by Stanley Kubrick who placed all sorts of clues about it in the Shining. Room 237

Is it possible that the landings occurred? Is it possible that even if they did, "they" used film done by Kubrick and his team for whatever reasons?

Related and not related -

My father's only sibling (both my father and his brother, Gil, are deceased) went to the University of Texas and was one of Alan Bean's best friends. I learned of this in 1970 when my uncle gave me a NASA model replica of the lunar landing module given to him by Alan Bean. Though my Dad and Gil were long gone by the summer of 2012 (my Dad died in 1979 and his brother in the late 80s), I searched the internet for Mr. Bean because I was in search of information regarding my Dad and uncle and thought, if the stories were true, he might shed more light on the matter.

I found he had a website presenting his art and there was a contact form. I wrote. I received an e-mail back within hours with his phone number asking me to call. I called and sure enough, Alan Bean verified their relationship and also shared with me his (and their mutual friends' concerns about my uncle's bouts with depression). He then started talking with me as if we were friends for years. He complained to me how young people just don't want to "get reality." He then went into stories about his daughter being such a "young person." I don't mean to say something I probably shouldn't but Alan passed on a few years ago and I don't think he would mind. So, anyways, the point I was leading up to is that within about 30 minutes, we had developed some affinity and trust and that's when I just couldn't help myself. I asked the question... essentially I asked, "Are aliens, are UFOs real?"

It was at that moment, almost like a switch was flipped... his tone changed, and he went into an answer that felt like a well honed script. Essentially flipping the question back on me asking me how I could think it would be possible to keep such a thing secret? And after he finished, he said, "nice talking to you," and hung up.

Now he was the 4th man to walk on the moon (so it is said). The sixth man, Edgar Mitchell, (so it is said), experienced a profound consciousness shift on his way back from the moon. This is well documented and so is the rest of his life. In fact, I think the famed Wilson Document is believed to have come from Edgar Mitchell's files after he passed.

Anyone who dives deep into "UFO/ET" is either an experiencer (of either a siting and/or a contact experience - good or bad or indifferent) or is someone with an extreme interest where they eventually understand, as Grant Cameron champions well, that consciousness is fundamental (to all and thus to ET). I also add that some folks either have direct experience with this or are open minded enough to the possibility that the key to UFO/ET is understanding this link to (and perhaps most important property) consciousness.

So back to Alan Bean... here's someone who would not, even in the vaguest and most benign (and non-NDA violating) way, allow himself to engage with someone who was the nephew of one of his best friends from university past his moon landing ventures yet if this had been Edgar Mitchell instead, I likely would have experienced a much different conversation once I popped the question.

And this is an example of two human beings, one the fourth and the other the sixth to walk on the moon (purportedly) and yet the difference between the two is astounding. And this is the same thing we experience across humanity. And I am sad that this is the case because IMO humanity is woefully held back, woefully stuck in a delusion of the import of materiality as opposed to soul and spirit.

Here's what opened my mind - My Anomalous Experience when I was Six Years Old
... an experience I have sought answers to ever since (and still come up empty though a recent visit to a psychic/medium confirmed what I wanted to believe and not what I rationally concluded... that my mother interrupted the process).
 
I want to put that which I wrote to some folk privately re my earlier post to TES in this thread (this is verbatim):

Ironically, I found out I was banned in the process of navigating to the moon landing doubts thread to express my regret at the hardline approach I took towards calling TES out. I had been intending to write something like this (though I have only expressed it in this level of detail now):

"Ah, man, that was a bit rough of me - sorry. Though I think your 'entropy effect' calculations were a load of crap, and though I think you sometimes make exaggerated claims that you probably have no right to make, on other occasions you contribute in a seemingly sincere and constructively-intended way, and the doubts I expressed about your claimed real life activities (that you really run a lab and really have started a bunch of businesses) were a little too strident and over-egged themselves. You do seem to have the sort of intelligence that would allow for those sort of accomplishments. It is easy, on reflection, for a single event to radically - in the moment - affect our view of another person, which is what my realisation that your 'entropy effect' calculation was balderdash did of my overall view of you, to my discredit."

--- End verbatim quote ---

I post that now that I have been unbanned. I want to add that it is posted completely voluntarily. Minimal if any pressure has been placed on me to make it: in private conversation on this issue, the moderator, David, sided with me. I write that which I wrote above out of my own conscience.
 
You knew you were banned before I did. I was hoping for some ground rules though. Of course personal attacks and logical fallacies might be entertaining for some. I don't think anyone wants to read this stuff. I don't want to, or a part of it. We should stay on the issues concerned in the thread as Dave requests. I think my suggestion is good, I'll post stuff and you can whine.

I think I have made a pretty good contribution.

I thought this was the Climate change thread. Lol

GunZ R are a Blazin! Pow! Pow!
 
Last edited:
David, again, as moderator, do you think that this sort of personal attack is appropriate?

This attack comes from a member who has been proved comprehensively to be wrong on several fundamental points of physics in this thread. If it were not for many of us pointing out his errors, they would have simply stood. Is it to be allowed that pointing out the fundamental errors of a member of this forum be characterised pejoratively as "whining", instead of as the public service that it is?
 
"But the Moon landing hoax, I would think, has to have some kind of expiration date.

How many decades can pass, after all, without anyone coming even close to a reenactment before people start to catch on? Four obviously haven’t been enough, but how about five, or six, or seven? How about when we hit the 100-year anniversary?

If the first trans-Atlantic flight had not been followed up with another one for over forty years, would anyone have found that unusual? If during the early days of the automobile, when folks were happily cruising along in their Model T’s at a top speed of 40 MPH, someone had suddenly developed a car that could be driven safely at 500 MPH, and then after a few years that car disappeared and for many decades thereafter, despite tremendous advances in automotive technology, no one ever again came close to building a car that could perform like that, would that seem at all odd?"

https://centerforaninformedamerica.com/moondoggie-1/
 
"Unfortunately, it isn’t just the video footage that is missing. Also allegedly beamed back from the Moon was voice data, biomedical monitoring data, and telemetry data to monitor the location and mechanical functioning of the spaceship. All of that data, the entire alleged record of the Moon landings, was on the 13,000+ reels that are said to be ‘missing.’ Also missing, according to NASA and its various subcontractors, are the original plans/blueprints for the lunar modules. And for the lunar rovers. And for the entire multi-sectioned Saturn V rockets.

There is, therefore, no way for the modern scientific community to determine whether all of that fancy 1960s technology was even close to being functional or whether it was all for show. Nor is there any way to review the physical record, so to speak, of the alleged flights. We cannot, for example, check the fuel consumption throughout the flights to determine what kind of magic trick NASA used to get the boys there and back with less than 1% of the required fuel. And we will never, it would appear, see the original, first-generation video footage.

You would think that someone at NASA would have thought to preserve such things."

https://centerforaninformedamerica.com/moondoggie-1/
 
"Unfortunately, it isn’t just the video footage that is missing. Also allegedly beamed back from the Moon was voice data, biomedical monitoring data, and telemetry data to monitor the location and mechanical functioning of the spaceship. All of that data, the entire alleged record of the Moon landings, was on the 13,000+ reels that are said to be ‘missing.’ Also missing, according to NASA and its various subcontractors, are the original plans/blueprints for the lunar modules. And for the lunar rovers. And for the entire multi-sectioned Saturn V rockets.

There is, therefore, no way for the modern scientific community to determine whether all of that fancy 1960s technology was even close to being functional or whether it was all for show. Nor is there any way to review the physical record, so to speak, of the alleged flights. We cannot, for example, check the fuel consumption throughout the flights to determine what kind of magic trick NASA used to get the boys there and back with less than 1% of the required fuel. And we will never, it would appear, see the original, first-generation video footage.

You would think that someone at NASA would have thought to preserve such things."

https://centerforaninformedamerica.com/moondoggie-1/
If it really happened they would have bronzed all that stuff. IT DID NOT HAPPEN. how much more do you need? WAKE UP NEO.
 
I think the most inspiring and incredible things about being on the Moon would to be standing on the surface looking at Earth. Imagine how incredible that would be. Look at the moon, The Earth would appear over four times as large on the Moon. That view would be the most significant thing of all. Simply dazzling on all levels, including spiritually. This astonishing feature would touch any normal human being.

Except on the surface the Astronauts don't talk about it. And there are only a few places over all missions that we see it through a few images and the footage. Those images are highly suspect. The one I have posted has clearly been composited and then changed over the years to hide the fact. I don't know how that can be denied. The others show it seemingly to change position. The video is awful and the Astronauts basically say nothing.

There are so many red flags, I think it is just rational rather than irrational to question it.
 
"Unfortunately, it isn’t just the video footage that is missing. Also allegedly beamed back from the Moon was voice data, biomedical monitoring data, and telemetry data to monitor the location and mechanical functioning of the spaceship. All of that data, the entire alleged record of the Moon landings, was on the 13,000+ reels that are said to be ‘missing.’ Also missing, according to NASA and its various subcontractors, are the original plans/blueprints for the lunar modules. And for the lunar rovers. And for the entire multi-sectioned Saturn V rockets.

There is, therefore, no way for the modern scientific community to determine whether all of that fancy 1960s technology was even close to being functional or whether it was all for show. Nor is there any way to review the physical record, so to speak, of the alleged flights. We cannot, for example, check the fuel consumption throughout the flights to determine what kind of magic trick NASA used to get the boys there and back with less than 1% of the required fuel. And we will never, it would appear, see the original, first-generation video footage.

You would think that someone at NASA would have thought to preserve such things."

https://centerforaninformedamerica.com/moondoggie-1/
As I mentioned earlier, it’s insanely expensive to fly to the moon. The cost actually exceeds NASAs yearly budget, supposedly. This wasn’t an issue during the Cold War as the government was ready and willing to fork over whatever cash was needed in order to beat the Soviets.

NASA’s yearly budget is 22 billion dollars. A trip back to the moon (in order to go an extra step compared to the last supposed visit to the moon) including putting up a makeshift station and visiting the South Pole, is estimated to cost 20-30 billion dollars. At least according to NASA.

As far as I know, NASA has faced a few budget cuts lately over the years.
 
It's interesting to consider the Edgar Mitchell story and his description of his spiritual awakening looking at the Earth on the return trip.

It is a wonder to me why that did not occur on the moon. But I can understand if he was consumed with the tasks at hand (if they really did go to the moon). But what I can't imagine is having such an awakening and remaining "on script" about the moon landing if it didn't really happen. And this just goes to show me that I just don't have the ability to "know." I just ain't smart enough to look at all the data and possibilities and figure it out. I read much of LoneShaman's and others like Creativemind's points and I read several of the counter points. I think LS/CM, et. al. make a good case. I brought up Room 237 above... to me, compelling.

So what I am saying... what I am pointing out is, sometimes we have to establish our best guess... and at many, many things, some more important than if/or not they landed on the moon. One of these things I think will always be a guess (indeed and IMO, the most important thing) is the question of what is fundamental to reality. The Hoffman Skeptiko and many other Skeptikos look at this.

I have, since 2016, settled on the assumption consciousness is fundamental. And everything (all thought and "every thing") all arise and exist within consciousness. And I accept that it is an assumption. And guess what? I don't need it to be proven the way science has required. I don't need a perfect mathematical proof to hold my assumption. I simply live my life knowing I hold this assumption. And the results are wonderful. And I always remain open minded in case somehow I am wrong and in case something arises that changes my mind.

So my point (which I will be addressing in the Hoffman Skeptiko thread) is that maybe the greatest "thing" we can accept is that our cosmological metaphysical world view (which is the fundamental world view to all of each of our "down stream" views) may forever be all and only an assumption. And maybe we should get over it.
 
As I mentioned earlier, it’s insanely expensive to fly to the moon. The cost actually exceeds NASAs yearly budget, supposedly. This wasn’t an issue during the Cold War as the government was ready and willing to fork over whatever cash was needed in order to beat the Soviets.

NASA’s yearly budget is 22 billion dollars. A trip back to the moon (in order to go an extra step compared to the last supposed visit to the moon) including putting up a makeshift station and visiting the South Pole, is estimated to cost 20-30 billion dollars. At least according to NASA.

As far as I know, NASA has faced a few budget cuts lately over the years.
Yes it was so expensive that after they beat the Soviets the first time, they went 5 more times to rub their noses in it.

Unfortunately spending all the money on gas for 6 trips meant there was nothing in the budget for any archiving of historic information. Or any room to store original plans/blueprints for the lunar modules. And for the lunar rovers. And for the entire multi-sectioned Saturn V rockets.
 
I just ain't smart enough to look at all the data and possibilities and figure it out. I read much of LoneShaman's and others like Creativemind's points and I read several of the counter points. I think LS/CM, et. al. make a good case.
"I just ain't smart enough to look at all the data and possibilities and figure it out."

It isn't simply a matter of being 'smart' - though that could help.

I've reached the conclusion that it is simply a matter of what is fashionable.

When one takes a more distant view of the ridiculous contortions that people put themselves through in order to seem trendy, to be 'in with the in crowd', there is a sense of quiet amusement. I guess we all go through these things at some stage, it is something we are all prey to, one way or another.
 
Yes it was so expensive that after they beat the Soviets the first time, they went 5 more times to rub their noses in it.

Unfortunately spending all the money on gas for 6 trips meant there was nothing in the budget for any archiving of historic information. Or any room to store original plans/blueprints for the lunar modules. And for the lunar rovers. And for the entire multi-sectioned Saturn V rockets.
ah ha, good point. I didn’t know they went back 5 times, I thought only twice in total.
 
ah ha, good point. I didn’t know they went back 5 times, I thought only twice in total.
Five times, plus Apollo 13 that had a failure on the way, and looped round the moon to return to Earth immediately.

Plans or no plans, there seems no doubt that the Saturn 5 did launch, and took a very large payload into orbit. It's role in the mission was over at that point.

LS - I think I asked you this once before, and you may have replied somewhere, but I'd love to hear what you think really happened - at least some version of what might have happened.

David
 
Top