Is Westworld our world?

Discussion in 'Extended Consciousness & Spirituality' started by AryaS, May 6, 2018.

  1. Steve

    Steve Member

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    For those among us who struggle with the question of ‘evil’, in this video, Rupert Spira gives his thoughts.



    I found it in Bernardo Kastrup’s forum where the same question was subsequently discussed. I have reached a place where, of course, I have my thoughts on such matters, and have in the past made an effort to express them here on the forum, but now I only rarely try to do so.

    Here is a link to the discussion in Bernardo’s forum:
    https://groups.google.com/forum/m/?fromgroups#!topic/metaphysical-speculations/Ju2Y88lpIis
     
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  2. Mishelle

    Mishelle Member

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    Just now getting into this conversation late with a lot of catching up to do, but finding it fascinating so far. I thought the article was posted on Arya's original post was really good even though I have not seen Westworld. Going to put it on my list, thanks Arya!

    Still I can get so much from the article alone and many of these themes are recurring in literature (and life) so I can relate them to other works I know. My initial attention has gone directly to this theme of memory and using it to program us to our disadvantage, most often disguised as being solely for our benefit. . Just how they sell all the 'great' spying technologies and folks line up around the block to purchase and play with them.

    And the reference to a recent Slavoj Zizek article that was embedded there is really good too, if y'all missed it: https://www.rt.com/op-ed/424709-sexbots-sex-dolls-rights/
    I find it particularly interesting to read about the rights of mechanical objects when culturally we've been completely unable to maintain the rights of sentient beings. I wonder if that's a great irony, or a necessary step to becoming objective about natural rights, for the 'masses' to consume and hopefully begin to question -- corporations have rights as people, some think animals should also have, now dolls, yet individual humans need not apply.

    To throw my personal conspiracy-loving slant on it I'd say for writers/producers to keep going back to this theme of control through memory is something of a red herring, whether they realize it or not. There is no need to go to that level of effort to control the perceptions of the crowd--all you have to do is convince them they are living on a spinning ball hurdling through space at speeds incalculable to any perception short of that of the new god, SCIENCE. There is no possible way they can see anything for what it is b/c it's a fantastic racing blur.

    Now put that in your pipe and take a good long puff!

    :)
     
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  3. Mishelle

    Mishelle Member

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    I don't know the parameters of the various labels, but I do have some thoughts on what might be happening with our modern-day conceptions of morality and good/evil. If you look back to some older languages you notice little things like 'bad/evil' is the same word, as in English they are closely related. In French the word 'malherbe' is the word for 'weed', and it would directly translate as 'bad/evil herb'. This is obviously highly subjective but equates to whatever it is you don't want in your garden. Does it really mean that particular plant is bad or evil? No, you just don't want it there, for whatever reason. What we don't distinguish between oftentimes is that there are 'malherbes' that are just undesirable, but not dangerous, not toxic, not injurious. You just don't like them/want them.

    What is happening in cultures worldwide now is not a question of 'good vs evil' exactly, in my opinion. It's more a question of wholesome vs dangerous. (Toxic is not synonymous with dangerous necessarily and there are varying levels) Lots of different kinds of 'bad' can be good for an organism, can make it stronger, more balanced, more authentically itself, more resilient, a better partner of the natural system.

    What we are trying to deal with now is an invasive parasite. I think the human consciousness is what they call in nature a 'super-organism' similar to a beehive. When a colony of honeybees gets too large, or too overrun with parasites, or generally diseased, somehow, quite mysteriously, "IT" decides they are in an intolerable space, and they proceed to swarm. Who decides? Obviously no one individual bee decides, not even the queen, it is actually to her disadvantage to swarm. Somehow among the colony a decision is made, and the bees collectively make that decision happen.

    Right now there are a bunch of us who agree it's time to swarm--the conditions in our colony have become intolerable. What we are trying to do is make sense of something that is primary and instinctual as humanity's super-organism. Those of us who see it are the 'scout bees' or the canaries in the coal mine so to speak. We are buzzing all around simultaneously trying to save our own livelihoods/survival at the same time we are trying to signal the other members of the colony that a swarm is imminent, whether they like it, see it, want it, or not.

    As for all the labels and fancy terminology and word salads, imo, if a 3rd grader can't understand it, it's not real. :)
     
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  4. Mishelle

    Mishelle Member

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    One more thing to add that I think is very relevant to this conversation, that of facing the 'shadow self' individual and collectively. I thought this test was actually quite telling--here it's summed up in the YT, but I didn't even watch the whole thing, the test alone and the faces worked for me right away and I saw the shadow-self instantly. I wonder if others here have the same result?

     
  5. AryaS

    AryaS Member

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    I think this video nicely encapsulates the conversation we've been having on this entire thread....

    1. Spira suggests that this/our collective physical Creation is the result of the Infinite Consciousness electing to experience the Finite -- i.e., to experience what it is like to be a finite/limited fragment of consciousness (this aligns with "Aaron's theory" or other amoral Creator theories presented in this thread).
    2. But in order to do so, Infinite Consciousness has to forget that it is Infinite -- in other words, it cannot know it is both infinite and finite -- it must forget itself so that it can view itself. (this suggests to me that IC cannot intervene or help to stop bad things from happening because it forgets it is infinite -- not sure how this aligns with some NDEr experiences of being assisted and/or prevented from dying by helpful non-physical beings, etc.).
    3. The problem of evil results from the finite fragments forgetting their infiniteness -- and feeling vulnerable. These finite fragments then act either by seeking to fill the emptiness they feel via relationships with others, or by trying to "protect" themselves from others by resisting/hurting/being unkind/cruel to other fragments.

    Ok-- fine. But many of us on this thread -- like the person asking Spira the Question in this video -- object to this explanation by pointing to the "extremes" we experience here -- and suggesting that the price of this Infinite Consciousness experiment is "too high." As the questioner suggests at around 10:36: "forget (or @#$%!) manifestation! Let's all go back to being Infinite Consciousness!"
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2018
  6. Steve

    Steve Member

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    How many of us really experience these ‘extremes’ Arya? I think that the vast majority of us don’t know anything about these extreme experiences, for most of us they’re in our head only. They exist, for sure, but I think it’s up to us whether we choose to focus on them or on the upside of life. Who knows? Maybe in our pre-earth state we do indeed choose to become involved in the darker side. Why, I just don’t know. Let it go until it becomes a reality, then deal with it. Maybe they’re the extreme wave riders and the mountain climbers that choose these lives, if that is what actually happens.

    I remember seeing a video of Natalie Sudman talking about her Near Death Experience in Iraq, after her car hit a roadside bomb. She said that she and another being laughed and had fun communicating over the state of her earthly body after the bomb had gone off. Pretty unusual stuff, but Natalie is a very sane person in my opinion.

    I just finished listening to this interview with William Buhlman, the Out of Body expert. In it he talks about the dark side, the hellish stuff that experiencers sometimes encounter. He thinks that it is _their_thoughts and fears that manifest such realities, and who am I to say he’s wrong.

    All we can do is our best.

     
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