Jan Irvin of Gnostic Media and Holocaust Denial

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Is there hard evidence for the Zionist Plot theory?

It seems to me many conspiracy theories put up a selective amount of dots and then the conclusion is supposedly obvious? The problem being that what is obvious or is in line with a particular narrative is dependent on the personal lens to glue together the pieces.
 
I have the impression that he was not a coward, and generally genuinely cared about the German people and instituted policies that genuinely and significantly improved life for the average German. Perhaps that impression is wrong?
So, the average German was a "pure blood" German? If you count German-Jews and others oppressed, into a qualitative equations measuring comfort and satisfaction, I don't see how the average was in a state of "improved life".
 
So, the average German was a "pure blood" German? If you count German-Jews and others oppressed, into a qualitative equations measuring comfort and satisfaction, I don't see how the average was in a state of "improved life".

After WWI, the Germans were under crushing economic circumstances due to the harsh terms of the Treaty of Versailles. Almost all historians now agree the extraordinarily harsh punishing terms of the Treaty of Versailles were unreasonable and certainly created the discontent among the populace that led to the rise of Hitler. My understanding is that Hitler removed the boot off the German economy's neck and jump started economic growth. Within a few short years of radical changes, the average German could afford a "Volkswagen" (the "People's Car") and had the freedom and affluence to afford to take leisurely vacations around the country. Compared to the previous 15 years of economic stagnation and oppression the change was so startling and the resurgence in national pride so great, that this explains Hitler's wild popularity and cult of personality surrounding him. He really took Germany out of the dumps, fired up the economic engine, and people loved him for it. We are in the exact same situation here in America with Trump (only no accusations of Jewish identity are being assigned to the lying press).
 
To start with something at the level of documentation that does indicate the Holocaust happened? From the Holocaust Museum->
I'm no expert, but I don't think the defendants were allowed to present evidence at Nuremburg - or I know any holocaust denial trial thereafter - that would prove their case, wild as that sounds to me. I also believe that one of the main men that "confessed" was tortured into it and never really conceded that anything like the holocaust as we know it took place under any other setting. Basically, he "denied" it from the beginning.

I also think that in the beginning things like candles made from fat and lamp shades made from skin were used as "evidence," but all of this was later retracted and shown to be phony.

Also, Hurm raised the idea of saying Trump led a genocide and whether or not one would be able to disprove it. It should be born in mind that no concentration-death camps were in Germany, though they were initially said to be. This was later retracted. The point is that to make a comparison, it'd be like hearing of death camps in other parts of the world, like occupied Iraq. How would the general populace know about such things?
 
Can you elaborate on that? What are the parallels?

America has been in an economic slump for a long time. The economy is in danger of total collapse on the edge between deflationary depression and hyperinflation due to Fed and big bank policies. People are discontented and voted in a populist who is doing everything he can to remove the economic restrictions and jump start the economy and bring industry back. Communist agitators and media orgs funded by rich globalists like Soros are spreading disinformation making exaggerated and false claims about Trump. Germans in 1933 were very concerned about uncontrolled immigration. It seems many of these globalists had another World War planned to take place very soon and are trying to pit nations against each other.

If you take out the pseudoscience and the eugenics and the hatred of Jews, Trump is "literally" Hitler.
 
After WWI, the Germans were under crushing economic circumstances due to the harsh terms of the Treaty of Versailles. Almost all historians now agree the extraordinarily harsh punishing terms of the Treaty of Versailles were unreasonable and certainly created the discontent among the populace that led to the rise of Hitler. My understanding is that Hitler removed the boot off the German economy's neck and jump started economic growth. Within a few short years of radical changes, the average German could afford a "Volkswagen" (the "People's Car") and had the freedom and affluence to afford to take leisurely vacations around the country. Compared to the previous 15 years of economic stagnation and oppression the change was so startling and the resurgence in national pride so great, that this explains Hitler's wild popularity and cult of personality surrounding him. He really took Germany out of the dumps, fired up the economic engine, and people loved him for it. We are in the exact same situation here in America with Trump (only no accusations of Jewish identity are being assigned to the lying press).
I've heard that England wouldn't allow German cruise/vacation ships to dock there because they didn't want the English commoner to see what was possible and how nice the German people doing . . . not sure about this, but I've assumed it was true.
 
I'm no expert, but I don't think the defendants were allowed to present evidence at Nuremburg - or I know any holocaust denial trial thereafter - that would prove their case, wild as that sounds to me. I also believe that one of the main men that "confessed" was tortured into it and never really conceded that anything like the holocaust as we know it took place under any other setting. Basically, he "denied" it from the beginning.

I also think that in the beginning things like candles made from fat and lamp shades made from skin were used as "evidence," but all of this was later retracted and shown to be phony.

Also, Hurm raised the idea of saying Trump led a genocide and whether or not one would be able to disprove it. It should be born in mind that no concentration-death camps were in Germany, though they were initially said to be. This was later retracted. The point is that to make a comparison, it'd be like hearing of death camps in other parts of the world, like occupied Iraq. How would the general populace know about such things?

Any links for evidence?
 
my personal peeve is that most discussions about "the Holocaust" prevent us from looking at the deeper question of our human and spiritual nature that allows this kinda stuff to happen. I mean, you might hear lip service about Pol Pot, Stalin, Mao, and on and on, but it's usually just a segue back to talking about the Holocaust.

From this perspective, there's nothing worse than Holocaust denial/apologetics. Of course, the Nazis did all these horrible things... as many have before and since.
 
my personal peeve is that most discussions about "the Holocaust" prevent us from looking at the deeper question of our human and spiritual nature that allows this kinda stuff to happen. I mean, you might hear lip service about Pol Pot, Stalin, Mao, and on and on, but it's usually just a segue back to talking about the Holocaust.

From this perspective, there's nothing worse than Holocaust denial/apologetics. Of course, the Nazis did all these horrible things... as many have before and since.

I don't think we should ever shy away from looking into the horrors of the 20th century and analyzing them to extract information about the deeper questions of human nature. In fact, after listening to a bunch of Jordan Peterson's lectures I just downloaded on Audible the Gulag Archipelago.

I've read "The Hiding Place" by Corrie ten Boom - a Holocaust survivor who went on a tour preaching a message of forgiveness and reconciliation after the war - powerful story.

I think the Nazis got into some terrible stuff - as did all the other world superpowers in the early 20th century... it was like an insane spirit took over the whole world during that time... or maybe it was just the industrialization of war meant humanity had to finally face down its own demons or otherwise destroy itself.

Personally, I just like to know what really happened... and when something strikes an immediate emotional response in me to not go there... it kind of makes me want to go there. I had an emotional reaction of revulsion to 9/11 conspiracies back in the early 2000s... I had an emotional reaction of revulsion to questioning the moon landings... I had an emotional reaction of revulsion to the idea of questioning the holocaust. I'm a very long way from saying the holocaust didn't happen at all, but I certainly think there was some mass deception going on as well... The Western press was apparently reporting the holocaust happening many years before it actually (apparently) did happen. The similarities between that time and our present time are so striking it really makes me further wonder to what extent we were deceived about the actual events during that time. It was a time of authoritarianism everywhere and very little opportunity for freedom of the press. Orwell's 1984 was based partly on things that were already happening.
 
my personal peeve is that most discussions about "the Holocaust" prevent us from looking at the deeper question of our human and spiritual nature that allows this kinda stuff to happen. I mean, you might hear lip service about Pol Pot, Stalin, Mao, and on and on, but it's usually just a segue back to talking about the Holocaust.

From this perspective, there's nothing worse than Holocaust denial/apologetics. Of course, the Nazis did all these horrible things... as many have before and since.

This is the exact question Jordan Peterson spent his life trying to solve, you might like to like to listen to the guy.
 
I'm in the middle of listening to this now... don't know who this guy is but so far seems like a reasonable sort of person to present the "denier" perspective. (By reasonable I mean I have not yet detected any white supremacist or racist undertones in what he has said so far)


 
I'm in the middle of listening to this now... don't know who this guy is but so far seems like a reasonable sort of person to present the "denier" perspective. (By reasonable I mean I have not yet detected any white supremacist or racist undertones in what he has said so far)




https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institute_for_Historical_Review

The Institute for Historical Review (IHR), founded in 1978, is an organization primarily devoted to publishing and promoting pseudo-historical books and essays concerning the Nazigenocide of Jews.[2][3][4][5][6] It is considered by many scholars as the center of the international Holocaust denial movement.
 
I'm in the middle of listening to this now... don't know who this guy is but so far seems like a reasonable sort of person to present the "denier" perspective. (By reasonable I mean I have not yet detected any white supremacist or racist undertones in what he has said so far)
"reasonable" is part of the shtick. once past this very thin veneer, he sounds like a totally wacky Holocaust denier to me. it's a funny group. I don't really understand the end game. it's not like they're making any money... maybe just a outsider group thing... IDK.

Youtube comments from his supporters are telling (e.g.):
The Six million Jews exterminated by Hitler is one of the biggest lies ever pushed into the human brain for more than seven decades. Its been scientifically proven that those so called Ovens were storage rooms and those camps in Auschwitz were camps for prisoners of war from all races and colors. The Six million figure has been going around long before...
 
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My suggestion would be that watching all 10 hours of SHOAH should be the starting point for understanding the holocaust.
I disagree... at least about the 10 hours part... and I think this is part of what fuels this wacky Holocaust denier stuff. I've watched a ton of sadly moving films on the Holocaust... there's no way to measure the extent of this misery.

I've also watch films like this very excellent one from a Cambodian journalist who lost his family in the killing fields and went looking for (and found) these murders:

again, no way measure this misery, or compare it to someone else's... but when we broaden the lens we can at least start to look at the larger spiritual questions and not get mired in this wacky "Holocaust denier" debate... i.e. it's not about Nazis, it's about how we are all susceptible to being manipulated into doing horrible things.
 
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