Lance Mungia, Third Eye Spies, What’s Behind Remote Viewing Disclosure? |434|

[lonevoice]

thx. excellent. now let me go skeptiko


love will durant, but he seems to have totally flubbed the Consciousness question:
=======
“Does history support a belief in God? If by God we mean not the creative vitality of nature but a supreme being intelligent and benevolent, the answer must be a reluctant negative.”

—Will and Ariel Durant, "The Lessons of History" (1968)
=======

why historians are wrong about almost everything


nice

maybe spiritual practice is all about cliff hanging without total panicking

I think that is what you have been doing, Alex. Along with all of us who are aware of the myriad horrors, while refusing to bypass or say "oh that's just maya". Walking on the razor's edge. Deep thanks for your courage.

 

[lonevoice]

wow I totally forgot about that. I think that's very significant. do you happen to have any links / references.

I had to sell my Mack books when I culled my library so as to live in a motor home. A quick search just now turned up this general video by Mack on reptilian encounters.

 

[lonevoice]

Hi lonevoice... I probably failed to convey what I wanted to convey in my prior post which was this - It isn't necessarily the words we use that could be, for some, a problem when we are talking about these fringe topics. It is the implications made surrounding those words that I was trying to highlight. In your post, there wasn't those derogatory implications... so when I read you stating "lizard people raping women" and the context within which you wrote that, there was no hint of "attacking the messenger." I should have made it clear that specific aspect of your post. As I started in my response, "This is my view as well," meaning that which you stated in your post as a whole, especially pointing to "cliff hanger" subjects.

What I didn't do was clarify the rest of my post was taking it all in an additional and different direction. I just edited my prior post to make that clearer. Apologies for this, Sam.

No apologies needed Sam. I could tell you weren't responding to my post. I just wanted to give a more "academic" understanding of my use of words. (Emotionally I still think they work for me!)

 

[Baccarat]

Reptiles, ETs, Angels it's sounds cool and all to talk about, but so what? The main premise of these theories is that the reptilian race and some species of ETs are malevolent. At this point of our journeys, all we can do is speculate and create fragile hypothesis and theories. Excess of information becomes burdensome and you eventually become to attached to the endless experts with similar or opposing points of view. I get it, it can seem cool talking to the general zombie population about this, but in reality what are we doing to get better in life? Who here has their own garden? Who here has some kind of training? Who here has any type of training in fighting? Can anyone symbolically decode dreams or has anyone developed remote viewing skills? This is endlessly petty and not productive for change, it's information communism and its useless now. We know of the possibiliities and what we might be up against through whistleblowers, disclosures, leaks etc. It's just coffee shop chatter and feeling less ego boost
I know some of you are old and getting that information out there to people waking up is important, but if you're under 50 it's time for preparation, political, judicial, farming, gardening, fighting, health and well being, protecting and educating your family. Who cares about death, at worst we will go back to the void and not be conscious of it and science will never ever find out of the after life exist because it's not MATERIAL lol

 

[Michael Patterson]

I finally got around to listening to the rest of the show, and found it one of the more thoughtful discussions on the RV theme [and related]. I was stimulated by the sense that what we call ET seems to be able to inhabit our inner and outer space, and we don't how how to handle this. I suspect we have so heavily invested in ET as occupant of 'spaceship' encountered in our physical dimension the notion that ET can appear in drug experiences is unsettling. But the account of the little bloke appearing post UFO encounter also suggests traffic the other way as well. But that's old hat.

The fact is that dimensions are not discrete domains with hard borders, rather zones that interact like ecosystems do. Human engagement with the other than human is as old as our memory. Its there in Eden and its there in the Dreamtime. Its our mentality and rigid imagination that leads us to persuade ourselves that we dwell in a discrete bounded reality. But we value and fear those who know this is not so - the shaman and the RVer.

The hint in RV is that it is possible. The fact that it is not tamely reliable is a ludicrous objection. Of course it is not. Were it otherwise this relative stable and predictable realm we think of a 'reality' could not exist. Here we see materialistic thinking at work. If its not repeatable and reliable then it is no good - and that's because those are the attributes of material being we treasure. Things that violate what we treasure should better be unreliable otherwise what we treasure is at risk.

However we are metaphysical/physical hybrids, and the two way flow between our natural dimensions is natural and normal. We don't control the flow - just awareness of it -and usually in an effort to build a wall. We feel safe in our mental and emotional walled communities - especially the cultural one constructed over the past 500 years. ET walks through our walls, and I am not even sure they notice them.

Just as RV 'violates' our sense of what is 'normal', ET violates our sense of 'reality'. In both cases its no more than a cultural and psychological construct. It ain't normal or real outside our conceit.

 

[Eric Newhill]

Reptiles, ETs, Angels it's sounds cool and all to talk about, but so what? The main premise of these theories is that the reptilian race and some species of ETs are malevolent. At this point of our journeys, all we can do is speculate and create fragile hypothesis and theories.

Cool to talk about? Down right dorky I'd say.

information becomes burdensome and you eventually become to attached to the endless experts with similar or opposing points of view. I get it, it can seem cool talking to the general zombie population about this, but in reality what are we doing to get better in life?

Right. How are you improving your energy, freedom, power and honor?

who here has their own garden? Who here has some kind of training? Who here has any type of training in fighting?

I'd add hunting for meat, but otherwise, spot on. If you can't defend yourself ( up to and including deadly force) and provide for yourself, you're a tool.

anyone symbolically decode dreams or has anyone developed remote viewing skills? This is endlessly petty and not productive for change, it's information communism and its useless now. We know of the possibiliities and what we might be up against through whistleblowers, disclosures, leaks etc. It's just coffee shop chatter and feeling less ego boost
I know some of you are old and getting that information out there to people waking up is important, but if you're under 50 it's time for preparation, political, judicial, farming, gardening, fighting, health and well being, protecting and educating your family. Who cares about death, at worst we will go back to the void and not be conscious of it and science will never ever find out of the after life exist because it's not MATERIAL lol

Nothing to do with being old and I hardly see 50 as "old" - you're probably a damn social justice marxist (hope I'm wrong about that), but you're right about what you say in this instance. It would be better , more real and more realistic to discuss to warrior techniques and training - to include remote viewing, etc - as opposed to alien lizard rapist theories and otherwise fringe-didn't-take-my-thorazine-the-other-day conspiracy theories.

 

[Baccarat]

Cool to talk about? Down right dorky I'd say.



Right. How are you improving your energy, freedom, power and honor?



I'd add hunting for meat, but otherwise, spot on. If you can't defend yourself ( up to and including deadly force) and provide for yourself, you're a tool.



Nothing to do with being old and I hardly see 50 as "old" - you're probably a damn social justice marxist (hope I'm wrong about that), but you're right about what you say in this instance. It would be better , more real and more realistic to discuss to warrior techniques and training - to include remote viewing, etc - as opposed to alien lizard rapist theories and otherwise fringe-didn't-take-my-thorazine-the-other-day conspiracy theories.

I'm far from a SJW Marxist

 

[Michael Patterson]

So I just watched this short vid - Dr. Steven Greer... paying particular attention to the point he makes starting at the 8:15 for the next minute or so... if true, and I happen to be quite open minded about it... then that which I wrote above (just six or so hours ago), is silly so...
never mind.

The trouble with Greer is that he inhabits a realm somewhere between what can be fairly imagined and bullshit and we have no way of knowing where in the place he really is. Are we crediting him for knowing or imagining? Here's my problem. Most of what he said I could imagine off hand -m and indeed have done so for much of it. But that's just because I plug into ideas, not because I have pals in UFOs. I like what Greer says but I can't / won't like the video because it seems to me to be a highly produced promo for Greer. As a stand alone there is no context and no source.

I know Greer is an industry these days. I have subscribed to his newsletter. What he is doing seems to be a service, and I don't find what he says objectionable in any fundamental way. But I also know That the moment folk start to make a living out of their passion they run the risk of producing bullshit to maintain the demand and the cash flow.

I don't know where Greer is on the spectrum of prophet to conman. I don't have the means or the motive to dig enough to find out. He has fascinating story - just do your due diligence before you swallow the attractive bait on offer.

 

[Wormwood]

I think the US intelligence agencies say publicly they ended the program, but it really continues in secret. The agencies would want other countries and organizations to think it is not useful so they would not try it themselves, and the US intelligence agencies would want to use it without oversight of the elected government.

Part of the problem with a public program is that there are two factions who would be continually trying to kill the program: materialists who would not believe it worked and Christians who would believe it was demonic in nature. There would not be many people who would actually support a public program except those who were inside and knew how well it worked. By running it as a secret program no one outside of it knows of its existence.

Exactly. Just as when the fact came out congruent with the Elizondo story that the US was spending several million dollars a year on studying UFOs, my first thought was, “do people really think they’re only spending several million dollars a year studying UFO/related phenomena.” They’ll publicly say whatever suits their best intestesfs, obviously.

 

[Michael Patterson]

Exactly. Just as when the fact came out congruent with the Elizondo story that the US was spending several million dollars a year on studying UFOs, my first thought was, “do people really think they’re only spending several million dollars a year studying UFO/related phenomena.” They’ll publicly say whatever suits their best intestesfs, obviously.

I think the problem is that ET represents an existential crisis for people, regardless of their beliefs, so for even sober US officials there is a fundamental problem of what to say and how much to say. I wouldn't expect easy agreement from competing POVs.

I know folk like Greer hammer the 'disclosure' message, but he inhabits a mindset conditioned to accepting a proposition that is still strange and threatening to most.

What exactly would the impact be on the general population is ET was to be confirmed? We can guess only. But the danger is that what is imagined or intellectualised is not what happens when reality strikes.

The 'They' who we presume know may be acting in what they think are our interests, and until we know what they know we can't really say whether they are right or not.

We operate in a cultural narrative that has told us we are pretty much the king of the hill. We are safe and content in a smug bubble of self-delusion maybe? You want that bubble pricked? There's a certain confident bravado expressed by people who are confident that reality is as they imagine it to be - only to be shattered and traumatised when the real stuff shows up.

I am not pro-disclosure in Greer's terms because I believe that 'disclosure' been going on for decades, maybe centuries. I don't know it is a process that is being managed by humans or ET separately or together. But I would be astonished if it is being managed incompetently - maybe erring on the side of caution a bit too much?

So I am curious about who the 'They' are and whether their 'best interests' are thought to be inimical to ours - and if so why so. I know Greer says somebody is sitting on what amounts to free energy and this is unfair. But on what evidence other than claims we cannot verify? I am open to compelling argument to the contrary.

 

[David Bailey]

What exactly would the impact be on the general population is ET was to be confirmed? We can guess only. But the danger is that what is imagined or intellectualised is not what happens when reality strikes.

It seems to me that with the recent disclosures, it is more or less proved provided the disclosures were not fake.

The response seems to be that the media has just shrugged and moved on! There has to be a reason for this, because I am sure the media are short of news stories on occasions.

David

 

[Michael Patterson]

It seems to me that with the recent disclosures, it is more or less proved provided the disclosures were not fake.

The response seems to be that the media has just shrugged and moved on! There has to be a reason for this, because I am sure the media are short of news stories on occasions.

David

I think the media moves on relentlessly in any case. Its rare to find a follow up on a story. It maybe also that there is a 'respectable' culture of materialism that permeates the 'educated' class from which most journalists are drawn. Generally ET is not taken seriously. Its a boring smug culture that does not need any inducement to flat out ignore anything that smacks of delusion, gullibility or superstition in their vapid worldview.

The real gets tossed in with the fake because it can't / won't tell the difference. You don't need to imagine there is a conspiracy of silence - its only a conspiracy of the smug and fatuous.

 

[Wormwood]

I think the media moves on relentlessly in any case. Its rare to find a follow up on a story. It maybe also that there is a 'respectable' culture of materialism that permeates the 'educated' class from which most journalists are drawn. Generally ET is not taken seriously. Its a boring smug culture that does not need any inducement to flat out ignore anything that smacks of delusion, gullibility or superstition in their vapid worldview.

.

I think it’s a combination of this and of the feeling that “well they’ve admitted that they’ve seen strange things but that still doesn’t PROVE that aliens are here. There’s likely possibilities that aren’t being considered, by us or maybe even the government.”

This is kept afloat by the vague nature in which the government has “disclosed” these things. They’ve basically said “we’ve seen some strange things.” If they were to come out and read a carefully prepared statement which states that they’ve dug into the matter deeply over decades and are convinced of ETs presence on the planet, that might produce a stronger effect on the media and the masses. But the strongest effect would come from producing a body or a recovered spaceship. As it stands now however, they’ve left skeptics a little wiggle room imo. This wiggle room, combined with the still existent ridicule factor, is the reason that this hasn’t really gotten anywhere substantial.

 

[Alex]

The trouble with Greer is that he inhabits a realm somewhere between what can be fairly imagined and bullshit and we have no way of knowing where in the place he really is. Are we crediting him for knowing or imagining? Here's my problem. Most of what he said I could imagine off hand -m and indeed have done so for much of it. But that's just because I plug into ideas, not because I have pals in UFOs. I like what Greer says but I can't / won't like the video because it seems to me to be a highly produced promo for Greer. As a stand alone there is no context and no source.

I know Greer is an industry these days. I have subscribed to his newsletter. What he is doing seems to be a service, and I don't find what he says objectionable in any fundamental way. But I also know That the moment folk start to make a living out of their passion they run the risk of producing bullshit to maintain the demand and the cash flow.

I don't know where Greer is on the spectrum of prophet to conman. I don't have the means or the motive to dig enough to find out. He has fascinating story - just do your due diligence before you swallow the attractive bait on offer.

totally get yr point, then again, this guy has been right in the middle of some really really big stuff:
https://omnitalkradio.weebly.com/pentagon-ufo-briefing.html

 

[Wormwood]

I think both Alex and Michael make good points here. Greer, in total, has been a positive influence on the field. And he’s clearly very passionate about it and it seems to me that his intentions are good. He’s more of a technician in my opinion. He’s good at compiling and presenting certain forms of evidence.

But regarding the actual philosophy/study of the nature and meaning of the UFO phenomena I’d be much more inclined to listen to Vallee, Dolan, or Cameron etc. Greer seems to have his mind set on certain things. I think a little more uncertainty is called for. Dolan and Vallee are great at maintaining a much needed honest uncertainty regarding the phenomenon.

 

[Alex]

I think both Alex and Michael make good points here. Greer, in total, has been a positive influence on the field. And he’s clearly very passionate about it and it seems to me that his intentions are good. He’s more of a technician in my opinion. He’s good at compiling and presenting certain forms of evidence.

But regarding the actual philosophy/study of the nature and meaning of the UFO phenomena I’d be much more inclined to listen to Vallee, Dolan, or Cameron etc. Greer seems to have his mind set on certain things. I think a little more uncertainty is called for. Dolan and Vallee are great at maintaining a much needed honest uncertainty regarding the phenomenon.

I realize this is super picky but I always get a little peeved with the term "field"... especially as it relates to our ( the general public's) relationship to the truth (secrecy) maintained by our government. it's kinda like there isn't a "field" as much as one misinformation disinformation campaign after another.

 

[Wormwood]

I realize this is super picky but I always get a little peeved with the term "field"... especially as it relates to our ( the general public's) relationship to the truth (secrecy) maintained by our government. it's kinda like there isn't a "field" as much as one misinformation disinformation campaign after another.

When I think of “the field” I think of UFOlogists like the ones I mentioned along with other authors/researchers, podcasts, and intelligent communities like this one. The government is a total afterthought to me regarding this study. If they opened up and we could somehow be sure that they were not withholding anything and were telling the truth, I might consider them the ultimate authority. As it stands though, they’ve contributed nothing. They haven’t told us anything we don’t know and in fact have told us way less than we already know from other and far more reliable sources.

 

[Michael Patterson]

totally get yr point, then again, this guy has been right in the middle of some really really big stuff:
https://omnitalkradio.weebly.com/pentagon-ufo-briefing.html

I am learning there are some things that are befogged in persistent uncertainty - in that they are stubbornly unresponsive to entirely rational inquiry. Its like some threads of ideas move from one cloud to another and that our habit of doggedly rational thought impedes our ability to engage. At some stage we have to step out of habitual mode of mind and enter an alternate one.

I think some people are like this also. If we engage with them in a doggedly rational way we are stumped and if we engage with them with pure faith and belief we enter a kind of peril. In the past we'd call these kinds of people mystics. These days I see people like Greer and Strieber as maybe such [not 'spiritual' mystics so much as disrupters of consciousness -amounts to the same thing really - if we can elude the traps of habituated meaning ] . The challenge is how we engage with them and their ideas - not whether they can [or should] be validated.

 

[Alex]

I am learning there are some things that are befogged in persistent uncertainty - in that they are stubbornly unresponsive to entirely rational inquiry. Its like some threads of ideas move from one cloud to another and that our habit of doggedly rational thought impedes our ability to engage. At some stage we have to step out of habitual mode of mind and enter an alternate one.

I think some people are like this also. If we engage with them in a doggedly rational way we are stumped and if we engage with them with pure faith and belief we enter a kind of peril. In the past we'd call these kinds of people mystics. These days I see people like Greer and Strieber as maybe such [not 'spiritual' mystics so much as disrupters of consciousness -amounts to the same thing really - if we can elude the traps of habituated meaning ] . The challenge is how we engage with them and their ideas - not whether they can [or should] be validated.

nice... but very tricky to do, eh? requires get out of our personal stuff and finding that deeper place where all this stuff connects.

 

[Michael Patterson]

nice... but very tricky to do, eh? requires get out of our personal stuff and finding that deeper place where all this stuff connects.

Of course. Its all about transforming our consciousness out of the mud of materialism and physicalism. Let's not imagine that a face to face encounter with ET is going to be other than radically transformative. We are not having what is going on on our terms - and if we think we can do that we will be played mercilessly.