Love Doesn’t Exist

Discussion in 'Consciousness & Science' started by TheRaven, Apr 3, 2018.

  1. TheRaven

    TheRaven Member

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  2. Number 22

    Number 22 Member

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  3. TheRaven

    TheRaven Member

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    Yeah, most of the time it is. But sadly, this is something in science that I actually agree with :(
     
  4. Number 22

    Number 22 Member

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    sadly :(
    but not this
    Materialists think this world is a mess and meaningless, but when a structure is too complex, sometimes it becomes meaningless to simplify it.
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2018
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  5. I know the universe doesn't exist because I can't see it when I close my eyes.
     
  6. tarantulanebula

    tarantulanebula New

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    I think, I'm able to understand English sentences, but just require tremendous time to parse and decipher every sentence.

    So original poster's hyperlinks require several nights for me to read.

    I just have a coarse browse and found perhaps it is to say that:

    If you mean "love" as a permanent and undestroyable thing, then this kind of "love" doesn't exist.

    "Love" as a feeling can be altered heavily by chemical substances, nerve science process, etc. The same to our consciousness, can be easily erased and reformed by higher existences.

    Perhaps it is better to say "love" is erratic, volatile, unstable, and unreliable, than to say it doesn't exist?
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2018
  7. tarantulanebula

    tarantulanebula New

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    Does that article only talk about "Romantic Love"?

    Perhaps, in western, there is a concept called "True Love", that is a "Romantic Love" between a pair of lovers, excluding any third involve. This is my guess, correct me if I made it wrong.

    The "True Love" features loyalty: male won't mate with another woman, female won't mate with another man, they won't hurt each other by betraying activity.

    If one says this "True Love" doesn't exist, because it is a certain chemical substance and a series chemical process which temporarily sustain this kind of "True Love", making the pair of lovers sticking to each other under its influences, it is by no means of some celestial design, fate's cherish, or primordial assignment appointment, if one says so, then I feel, it is perhaps better to say, "True Love" is a wishful fantasy.

    In our mundane world, there are plenty betray, lies, hurt between "for a time" lovers, even if they love passionately while their bond still hasn't been broken. Men swerve to love another girl, just because the previous girl no longer cause his interest and there comes a new girl more young, more pretty, more sexy-. Women swerve to love another man, just because the previous man is not rich enough, strong enough, handsome enough, attractive enough, or something else.

    It is what love always is, tattered the veil of adult fairy tale and soul chicken soup or anything alike. It is all the way the same. It is always erratic, unstable, unreliable, evanescent. One can cheat himself or the others, but the truth is the truth, it is bitter or sweet, it is bright or dark, it is anyway the truth. So love is always this kind of thing, never different, never overwhelm or refute itself, it ends as it starts, it is not self illusory, fairy tale, or primordial appointment.
     
  8. Number 22

    Number 22 Member

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    It's remind me of brian cox and his '' disprove" ghost Project ;)
     
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  9. tarantulanebula

    tarantulanebula New

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    I posted my personal affairs about that a woman who I acquainted, she was pregnant and was neglected by her husband. She was not well cared by her husband, despite how much she loved him.

    I had moved to another place for several reasons, have not seen her for almost a year, and I heard from friends that her marriage was not going well, perhaps she had divorced, I'm not sure.

    Since I left the place she was around, I completely emotionally got out of her, when I was around that place, I felt sympathy for her being neglected, sometimes even helpless, my sympathy even elevated to a degree could vaguely be called "love" around that time. Now I do not feel it should be me to meddle her difficulty, I have more important things to do, to care about.

    Around that time, I posted many affairs on this nice forum, about how I felt about her, and felt agony myself, and many people here solaced me, helped me, who I'm very grateful to but sorry I now can't enumerate everyone of them.

    Also I'm very sorry my posting was not pertinent to the major theme of this forum and was not an intelligent discussion. I'm very sorry I deviated the main interest belonging to this nice forum.

    But, in this thread, my personal experience in my life, including my observation to the relationship of the people I met in my life, perhaps can be regarded as a testimony to original poster's question, or confirmation: "Love Doesn't Exist", provided that if you mean "love" as a fantastic, eternally pure "True Love".

    In reality, too many betray, swerve, lies, hurt, disregard, agony, mistakes, and many many other unpleasant events in human's love relationships. I want to say that I feel it is always in this way, which perhaps implies that soul chicken soups are all wishful thinking, placebo, fantasy, or fairy tales.

    However, I feel it is perhaps unfair to say "Love Doesn't Exist", it is perhaps more about that I should cherish the love's evanescence, erratic, and all the mistakes, all the hurt it caused and undertook, it emitted and received, I should forgive "love", not being too strict to require it to be absolute consistent or loyal forever or something.

    I feel I should try to love the one I should love, when I am still able to love, and be very careful to not be hurt by a wrong love, and be very careful to not hurt the others. This is what I can do, to the most, to the least, it is by no means a love in accordance with the definition of "True Love" which doesn't exist if thinking this way, this is a tolerance to that love is always such an imperfect thing, and allow it be not so nice as I originally wished, and still cherish as to its most out of its still good aspects.
     
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  10. TheRaven

    TheRaven Member

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    This gave me a good laugh:D I have trouble understanding how love could exists within the human race when it comes to relationships.It all seems like it is only about procreating and making the species survive.
     
  11. Silence

    Silence Member

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    No, that's part of the siren's song woven into our existence to misdirect us from the deeper truth.

    The birth of my children was at the same time the coolest "material" thing I've ever witnessed and proof of the "divine" all rolled into one. There's something there that goes much deeper than ensuring my rather pedestrian gene pool continues its course through spacetime.
     
  12. TheRaven

    TheRaven Member

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    This was rather poetic and profound. I still am on the fence about love though. I read an article the other day that basically was saying how women past the age of 25 were used up and men didn’t find them as attractive as they were in their late teens/early twenties due to that age range being when a woman is at her most fertile. It made me think of the cliche trope of the husband leaving his wife for someone younger, which happens more often than you would think. It makes it seem like all their is to life is continuing our genes and having offspring.

    A lot of Nder’s state that this physical existence is all about love, both giving and receiving. But, I sometimes wonder if it is the opposite. Perhaps we all are here to experience a loveless existence. Why this would be the case, I haven’t a clue, but with the world seeming so indifferent and love not being some fairytale fantasy, I can’t help but to think this is the case.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2018
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  13. tarantulanebula

    tarantulanebula New

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    Hello Raven, my personal experience totally conforms to your writing this:

    Men loss interest in a woman when she has been used up. Men tend to spread his gene as widely as they can. Women tend like to collect excellent gene, and modern science has found that they even "preserve" the genetic substances from the men (even more than one) with whom they once mated. Many women gave birth to children completely not belong to their husbands or partially not belong to their husbands.

    I don't extend too further in this, this is bitter to face and swallow but truth is truth. And I don't extend my personal experience about a neglected wife too further lest it would deviate the main theme of this nice forum.

    But I want to say that even if there are exceptions in which case men and women do seem loving each other without a sneaky viciousness, it is still a biological "trade-off" strategy.

    When men find his wife's gene is too well mated with his own, or he feels to swerve to a younger girl would consume too much energy of his own, he would choose to help his wife to raise the common offspring of theirs, as still a strategy to maximum the survival of his own gene. Some women love a single man without cease and without betray also because of a "trade-off" strategy lest even if they could find a more excellent gene from a stronger man or richer man, this man would not care about protecting her body which needs to be a utility for conceiving the offspring of her own gene.

    It is all the way same.

    As to celestial design, divine intervention, some mysterious and transcendent appointment for sustaining the "grandeur purposes" of "love", I shouldn't say that they don't exist, but I follow the rule: when I get no information, I would ignore any fantasy by default without talking about their existence or nonexistence. I don't know so I temporarily ignore right now.

    At least, it seems, I mean, IT SEEMS, that, all the human love can be reduced to an explanation of biology and chemistry, nothing more. I'm open minded if I could get more information in the future, but I do not have a wishful expectation.
     
  14. TheRaven

    TheRaven Member

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    This post didn’t show up for me, so sorry for not responding. I agree with everything you said and this is what I’ve been trying to articulate lol. Your english is very good by the way:)
     
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  15. tarantulanebula

    tarantulanebula New

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    Never mind, dear TheRaven, you are by all means welcome.
    I just noticed that you are a lady. Female's heart is softer, so if you feel my "telling the bitter truth" is way too cold or cruel, I apologize. :)

    Even if it is all about biology and chemistry, I do believe many men and women could find a state of their lover relationship, which would feel like "True Love", although under the chemical rule's allowance.

    Sometimes I wonder, if a God (or any epithet you use to name the creator) had once liked to create a feeling of "love" for us to feel but didn't make it "truly exist", why he wouldn't have simply prohibited his desire and simply created a really cold emotionless world with everything rotating around the cold physical rule. That would be no hurt and no loss to his original purpose.
     
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  16. TheRaven

    TheRaven Member

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    I would rather know the cold truth than to believe a beautiful lie:) I’ve never been interested in relationships, mainly due to the fact that I’m asexual, so knowing the “bitter truth about love” doesn’t particularly upset me.
     
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  17. David Bailey

    David Bailey Administrator

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    Well surely sexual attraction or fertility can't be equated with love? I mean there are plenty of men who stick by their spouses even if they become handicapped in some way, and maybe can't even have sex any more.

    David
     
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  18. Silence

    Silence Member

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    There seems to be a conflating between romantic and generic "love" to my eye. What about "love" for parents, siblings, children, friends, strangers, pets, etc.?

    I mean all that is simply a biological response to procreation?

    Sure isn't my experience.
     
  19. TheRaven

    TheRaven Member

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    Sexual attraction plays a big role in relationships. The fact that a man can “love” a woman until her “prime” then leave her for a more “desirable” female seems to indicate that sexual attraction is more important than other feelings in a partner. There are also plenty of people who leave their significant other when they are disabled or handicapped in some way.
     
  20. Larry

    Larry Member

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    Yes! and
    How about love as the primary driver or field through witch we evolve and it's expressions or manifestations are on a continuum the higher of which moves toward compassion and recognition of interconnectedness
     
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