Sean Carroll

Discussion in 'Consciousness & Science' started by Number 22, Jun 3, 2018.

  1. tarantulanebula

    tarantulanebula New

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    I think I understand what you mean.

    Years by years, I have read a lot of nde, past life memories accounts, but all in English languages. The people in those accounts might be from different countries and ethnics, but the narrations were all in English languages.

    If those accounts had been written (first hand written excluding translated) in my mother language, I would have been much more intensively sensitive on many subtle aspects of them.
    Like, I would have a sense that whether those accounts had been written in a "novel style", in a "story build", in a "pretentious posture",
    in a "mincing attitude",
    in an "urgent propagating and preaching inclination",
    in a "bias stance",
    in an "extravagant atmosphere",
    in a "hidden special purpose",
    in a "whimsy streak",
    in a "paranoid and stubborn precognition",
    in a "thick religious or political background",
    in a "plethora of narcissism",
    in a "self oriented spiritual therapy",
    in an "euphoric abnormality",
    written by a "not serious romping pupil", etcetera.

    But in English language, all those sensitive perceptions for subtle aspects are absent or dimmed to me. Because a person's understanding of a language not written in his mother tongue, is limited in many subtle aspects. One can seldom understand a foreign language as comprehensive as his mother language.

    However, within the most recent one year or two, I have read several nde accounts written by my native people in my mother language. That's important. At least that gave me a hard evidence that "near death experiences" are not western bubbles generated in the bathroom.

    I can tell, there is no overt or obvious superstitious trace in those several nde accounts from native of mine, and the writing was not like by a not serious romping pupil. Considering that my mother country was super superstitious in history, a shameful history with low education rate and less civilized civilization in scientific fields, with many ancient archives left untrustworthy, I think those several accounts are a milestone demonstration to me that nde is a widely existent phenomenon spread all over the world.

    I can not tell whether those narrators are honest, or whether their points of view are prudent, rational. But this gives me an impression that nde is a very very unusual phenomenon, not like a voodoo ritual in a tribe, which can be easily explained as a simple cultural product out of primitive ignorance.

    When I read you saying "an immense amount of empirical evidence for the phenomena of parapsychology, including...." I thought perhaps you reminded and brought up to me that it couldn't be that so many people are all frauds or whimsy streak minded at the same time, if by any means it is so, then there must be an unusual reason behind this big international coax. At least nde is such unusual kind of phenomenon viewed in this way. Why so many vivid experiences happened in a situation where there should have been no vivid experience, and why many experiencers believe it is real unanimously, with also many exceptions but still consider it as unusually vivid, though.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2018
  2. tarantulanebula

    tarantulanebula New

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    I pondered and fathomed what does this sentence mean:
    Although I do not yin into the psychology like you but I just feel difficult.
    and I figured it out:
    You mean "yin into the psychology" as "melancholy in mind", right? "yin" means "cloudy, dark, unhappy, negative, depressed". :D

    I concerned that you psychologically need a firm faith, so the striking and tearing to your original faith put you on a bewildered and perplexed situation. I understand how you feel, my faith had been stricken and torn apart again and again in the past decades, and I'm accustomed to this. ;)

    Don't feel sad, faith is a simple thing, and simple thing is fragile, it will be broken sooner or later, depending on how lucky or hapless you are. Later you will form your own faith, which is not a common faith like religion shared by many people, your own faith is complex and mature, and will give some guidance in your path of living along the way.

    As to the confusion you said, I don't know.... Perhaps we meant to be confused, we can't escape, so just struggle in this confusion, find a point where we can ease ourselves, like find an iceberg to lean on when we are dropped in an icy ocean. I feel partially the same as you do. :(
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2018
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  3. tarantulanebula

    tarantulanebula New

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    According to my personal experiences and observations, I feel different people have different sources, tiers, fates and arrangements. OK, this is obviously and a duh, but, let me explain further.

    For me personally, I think it is probably that I'm a slave or a prisoner captured and sent to earth by a higher force. Well, I believe that this life of mine (I don't imply that this isn't or is the only life that I can have) is arranged contradicting the very nature of my soul in many ways. The mismatch of my spirit and my body, the unfriendly and dislike attitude between the people near me and myself, all endorse the fact that the higher force sent me to earth not for enjoying a meaningful life, but for suffering tremendously without chances of producing any good result for anyone, no matter how bitter I swallow and how hard I try, I may involuntarily commit guilt to the others one way or another. And the others don't quite tolerate or sympathize the difficulties that I am in, and not many people near me are able to and/or are interested in providing helps, all they do is spitting phlegm and throwing stones on me when I'm trapped in a pit. No no it is not a training with good purposes, it is a punishment and a shameful insult.

    My situation is very difficult and nasty, and guilty, I don't enjoy this life of mine, yet there is something more to my suffering. Very early in my life I had foreseen that in the future there would be many trials for me that if I wouldn't be able to swallow large chunk of suffering, I would disgust the people surrounding me and be causing bad influences to them every moment which also bestow a twisted torment reflection to myself. I don't want to badly influence the people near me, causing trouble to them, but in order to achieve that goal, I need to swallow unacceptable large bitter suffering which is beyond every ability of mine and is unrealistic for me to swallow. Oh I tried, I know how it feels. And then every single particles in this universe condemn me for being weak, awkward, coward, greedy, enjoying, lazy, irresponsible, etc. Me too, condemn myself.

    I know the arrangement. Sometimes I ask myself what are my emotion and attitude towards this arrangement. Then I can't circumvent, I can't escape from answering my question that what is my emotion and attitude towards the people near me and eventually, the higher force who determined my life arrangement. Hatred? No, I don't and shouldn't hate anyone of them. It isn't easy to utter this answer when I'm being tortured. You will understand how it feels when you are in a similar situation. Hatred towards someone who is torturing you is not a self determination, but a biological reaction. OK, still, I answer no to myself, under suffering.

    I know the higher forces dislike me, or even hate me, and they refuse to give me answers, guidance, not to mention a relief of the suffering, no I don't want a relief, I want a method to swallow the suffering but I couldn't find a method. Like, imagine the most unswallowable thing in this world to me, yeah, I need to swallow them as soon as I can in order to stop causing trouble to people near me, but since it is the most unswallowable thing worse than shit, it is not easy, driving me mad. I say the higher force is cruel. But look around this world the higher forces (there probably are many discrete factions rather than a single one) actually hate many many people, not only me, I have no right or reason to complain anything.

    According to my personal experiences and observations, I think probably the higher forces like someone while hate some others. For me, I believe it's for certain that the higher force doesn't like me, but it somehow gives me a mercy so far, for a time. Obviously I'm not the most tragic person in this world so I need to struggle as best as I can. I now view my life as a mission in Silent Hill and the people near me are all terror, they are neutral or malicious, for some of them I need to forgive them and avoid offending them carefully, for some of them I need to cherish and help them even if they are so inadvertent, imprudent and indifferent to me, and for some very malicious ones I need to defend myself against them. I know I can't determine anything and can't control over anything. The higher force hates me in one way or another I have no space for objection or escape. I will struggle while watching the different degrees of the happiness and tragedies of the many others, and at a time, tragedy of mine, struggle like a cockroach in a bottle containing insecticide, struggle as best as a clumsy bug can.

    There might be an answer why those higher forces hate me, but I won't be granted an answer, I'm very sober to face these, at this very moment, though being driven crazy. So you see why I learn English language so earnestly? It's a part of my struggle that my job needs this skill. I need to work hard. I'm sorry, I'm sorry that I'm a plague and abomination and a shame to the people near me, I'm sorry the higher force hates me. I do not hate them because they are mercy not to chase me to the brink of a cliff, and still leave a room for me to struggle bitterly, actually it must be my own fault that how sad a trash am I. I need to struggle like all those people who are hated by whoever, whatever higher force or whatever god, goddess of fate.

    Many years ago one colleague of mine kept reading rubbish novels during work time, I asked him when we were having lunch, since he had read so many novels and he was so obsessed by novels, whether he had heard of the stories of Cthulhu, he shook his head, like as if what an unpopular and weird word I had uttered out. While what he was interested in were all with super stupid and repetitive scenarios of several super powerful saints and knights fighting the evil and saving the world gleefully.

    The stories of Cthulhu series was made by a genius novelist who had suffered a tormenting life in his time. I think he understood partially of what I feel now. The world is like described by the stories of Cthulhu. I love Cthulhu series and many background designs and ideas in it.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2018
  4. Number 22

    Number 22 Member

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    In fact, I have a very different perspective on you.
    I do not think everything as you think, I just think that shit we are pure consciousness entangled in matter, evolution and motivation is the way to rid ourselves of this absurdity.
    I love novels and do not see trash stories, I often read about fantasy novels and play games about it. I have seen so many things in real life so these are a way to relax.
    I do not really want to. See the world in a cruel way.

    I think I will try meditation to find peace, maybe you should try.:D
     
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  5. tarantulanebula

    tarantulanebula New

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    All right, different opinions and niche don't put us on opposite sides.

    However I think you are somehow lucky. If you had another fate you would think differently. Nevertheless, may good fortune always rest upon you.
     
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  6. Number 22

    Number 22 Member

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    I do not want to complain here but I do not think I'm lucky.
    I was an absolute pessimist because of the circumstances of growing up. But it seems I have changed.:D
     
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  7. tarantulanebula

    tarantulanebula New

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    Just now I recalled one thing, the reason why I said that, it was stupid stories that colleague of mine read many years ago, is that his fate was super lucky.

    In that company, we had been treated super unfairly, he could read novels during work time, and never needed to do an overtime work. On the opposite, I worked every moment and still needed to do overtime works. And he was paid much more than me. I had never had a too aggressive or too weak or deviant strategy of getting along with colleagues and bosses. Well, don't get into too deeply about how I managed my job and all the peripheral conditions relevant to my salaries and positions. I didn't do those wrong.

    But I know why, why so unfair, first, my intelligent quotient is lower than him, it's true, but it's not my fault. Someone might say that so that you just should accept your disadvantage and do as best as you can, not compare with him, he deserves what his competence can get and you deserve what yours can. The things were more complicated and are still complicated till today. I learned wrong things in my college, so I needed to learn new things after I graduated. But I constantly had headaches during those times without knowing why, that deterred my advance of learning skills my job needed. Despite the fact that I suffered, my family didn't show some sympathy and condemned me that I earned too less, bestowing a bad reputation among elder circle and losing faces of my family. Under this circumstance you thought I would find a peace by meditation? Easy to say. I just wanted to find a way to master as much knowledge as my job needed and as quickly as I can, under the circumstances without anyone instructing me or just tell me which book to read, which tutorial to start from. I got super depression and the situation just more and more deteriorated.

    There were still many untold stories that I have no room or need to go into too many details here. So refer back to that colleague of mine. During those times, his job tasks were much much easy to him so he was leading a very relax life and work. And I found he never took any interest in tales of Cthulhu, I don't only mean Cthulhu, no, my meaning is not so narrow, I mean, every "not naive scenarios of story", in other words, he never took any interest in tales containing a dark and twisted plot, instead the stories he was reading were all like "bad men did bad things, and there came a hero savior who at first undertook an arduous fighting against him and wounded greatly then boom, hero won, beauty embraced, world happy!". I couldn't fathom wasting his time to read this kind of repetitive junk was to his felicity.

    So, he was super happy, he was super lucky, a lovely winner of life, a life champion, a gentleman and wizard with all positive beliefs like a shining grail, some more nice words here.... I don't envy him or resent him or something. But I just drew a conclusion, people think things positively because they lack the experiences and the understanding of the tragic fate and dark side on earth. And that puts those people in an incomplete view of this world, no matter how intelligent they are. Thus they just immerse into their own lucky happiness and won't feel any sympathy to any unhappy person in this world with thinking every trouble is one's own making and those sufferers are all stupid and bad behaved and deserve their fate.

    You can never find any soothing in the innocent, ignorant, naive happy people who are granted a bathing in the holy light of super luckiness. It is hollow to consider their ways of thinking, their interests in the simple and naive good affairs or story plots, and their rejecting of any melancholy thoughts.

    One needs to ask that why the author of series of Cthulhu can conceive such a profound scenario which can resonate with many people who are under the bewilderment and fear and are being saturated in the spiritual agony? The author had experienced something completely different and invisible to super lucky ones, he knew something, he knew light is always a contraption used to cover the dark truth.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2018
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