TALKING EVIL WITH ALEX TSAKIRIS -- GORDON WHITE -- RUNE SOUP

Being a hero is a lot to ask from huge swaths of human beings who are given precious little to go on a hero's journey with. Have you been asked to be a hero? Do you constantly have to live up to hero status? That's exhausting!

What kind of Reality puts huge swaths of individuals into positions where they must overcome immense odds just to eke out a livable existence while numerous power elite get to keep that game going so that the cruelty continues unabated?

If we look at reincarnation, at least the evidence we have for it, it doesn't seem like we have answers to that. What wrongs did some inner city or rural poor children do to deserve their position in life? What great virtues did Donald Trump do in a past life in order to get all his fame and fortune in this life?
I know what you mean, but revolutions such as what happened in France and Russia simply didn't go well. There are too many scores to be settled. When Nelson Mandela became president, he instituted a truth and justice investigation, but didn't actually prosecute the white rulers for their actions. Something similar happened in Czechoslovavia when communism fell. Compare that with what hapened in Iraq, the US forces toppled Saddam Hussein and banned members of his party from all public posts. The country simply collapsed.

'Fairness' has to take second place to feasibility, continuity, etc. otherwise the cure is far worse than the disease. An ill thought out major change in the US could be disastrous.

David
 
Being a hero is a lot to ask from huge swaths of human beings who are given precious little to go on a hero's journey with. Have you been asked to be a hero? Do you constantly have to live up to hero status? That's exhausting!

What kind of Reality puts huge swaths of individuals into positions where they must overcome immense odds just to eke out a livable existence while numerous power elite get to keep that game going so that the cruelty continues unabated?

If we look at reincarnation, at least the evidence we have for it, it doesn't seem like we have answers to that. What wrongs did some inner city or rural poor children do to deserve their position in life? What great virtues did Donald Trump do in a past life in order to get all his fame and fortune in this life?
Aren't all of us asked to be heroes? Isn't that the point of life? We go on this journey and try to make the best of it and see beauty along the way. Life isn't fair. It doesn't have to be. It's what you make of it.
 
Being a hero is a lot to ask from huge swaths of human beings who are given precious little to go on a hero's journey with. Have you been asked to be a hero? Do you constantly have to live up to hero status? That's exhausting!

What kind of Reality puts huge swaths of individuals into positions where they must overcome immense odds just to eke out a livable existence while numerous power elite get to keep that game going so that the cruelty continues unabated?

If we look at reincarnation, at least the evidence we have for it, it doesn't seem like we have answers to that. What wrongs did some inner city or rural poor children do to deserve their position in life? What great virtues did Donald Trump do in a past life in order to get all his fame and fortune in this life?
I don't know that he's that happy. Anyone that has to talk himself up like that, is compensating. I know what you mean about being financially stable, though. Why are some people better off than others? I don't think we'll ever know.
 
Why are some people better off than others? I don't think we'll ever know.
Well this is inevitable and reasonable, it is only when you find people with excessive wealth that it starts to look bad.

For example, I think a doctor should get paid well for all the learning he has had to put in, plus the general stress and responsibility of the job.

More generally, those who just want enough to get by and to concentrate on other things, are going to be paid less than those who take on more responsibility.

A similar situation happened in the late 60s to early 70s. I believe the backlash was called Reaganomics
But this seems more about social issues.

David
 
Well this is inevitable and reasonable, it is only when you find people with excessive wealth that it starts to look bad.

For example, I think a doctor should get paid well for all the learning he has had to put in, plus the general stress and responsibility of the job.

More generally, those who just want enough to get by and to concentrate on other things, are going to be paid less than those who take on more responsibility.


But this seems more about social issues.

David
I agree partly. I think obviously some jobs will be compensated more but why so much more? The federal minimum wage hasn't risen since 2009...does anyone see a problem here?
 
I don't know that he's that happy. Anyone that has to talk himself up like that, is compensating. I know what you mean about being financially stable, though. Why are some people better off than others? I don't think we'll ever know.
Some people put more effort into their lives and some don't is one reason. There are others, but that is definitely one reason. Its really basic to see and understand.

Now, if you think government should act like some third party external "GOD" thing and "make everyone" financially and possessionally equal at some specific point in time, even if government could do that, some people would squander most of it and others would grow some of it and then, guess what, once again, everyone would be externally financially and possessionally unequal!

And while government might, on some specific day, make everyone externally financially and possessionally equal, what is impossible to do is to make everyone ethically and morally the same - well... unless they complete their goal of inserting their nano chip technology in every living human being which so happens to be hooked up to AI via Elon Musks tens of thousands of satellites doing 5G (soon 6G and on and on) where the human being, as a sovereign being no longer exists... you might have emotion, but with their super quantum computer precision analyzation capabilities on how to precisely manage those, individualization will vanish and soul will no longer have a function.

Say hello to the dream of the demiurge and his archontic henchmen... say goodbye to life with any meaning.

Ohhhh and thank all of ya'll who have wittingly or not, increased the rate of acceleration towards this orwellian brave new world nightmare.
 
I agree partly. I think obviously some jobs will be compensated more but why so much more? The federal minimum wage hasn't risen since 2009...does anyone see a problem here?
I basically agree, but changes must be done gently - otherwise chaos ensues - as I have described.

I would also say that you cannot favour one race over another (as now seems to be the case), because it just bakes unfairness into the system.

Part of the problem with 'Left' policies right now, is that so many of them just seem to be about gaining power - we must get back to real politics, where parties actually present alternative policies that can be performed.

David
 
Some people put more effort into their lives and some don't is one reason. There are others, but that is definitely one reason. Its really basic to see and understand.

Now, if you think government should act like some third party external "GOD" thing and "make everyone" financially and possessionally equal at some specific point in time, even if government could do that, some people would squander most of it and others would grow some of it and then, guess what, once again, everyone would be externally financially and possessionally unequal!

And while government might, on some specific day, make everyone externally financially and possessionally equal, what is impossible to do is to make everyone ethically and morally the same - well... unless they complete their goal of inserting their nano chip technology in every living human being which so happens to be hooked up to AI via Elon Musks tens of thousands of satellites doing 5G (soon 6G and on and on) where the human being, as a sovereign being no longer exists... you might have emotion, but with their super quantum computer precision analyzation capabilities on how to precisely manage those, individualization will vanish and soul will no longer have a function.

Say hello to the dream of the demiurge and his archontic henchmen... say goodbye to life with any meaning.

Ohhhh and thank all of ya'll who have wittingly or not, increased the rate of acceleration towards this orwellian brave new world nightmare.
Haha...that's extreme. This is what happens when people are angry at an unfair system. I mean I don't see as much doom and gloom as others on this forum but I think the anger is justified.
 
Haha...that's extreme. This is what happens when people are angry at an unfair system. I mean I don't see as much doom and gloom as others on this forum but I think the anger is justified.
Do you have any siblings? Imagine having an identical twin. Things should be equal being the same age/sex and growing up in the same family. But what happens after you get jobs and leave home?

Would you want mom and dad to take money that one of you had earned and give it to the other if he or she made less? Over time, neither one of you would want to put in any effort, because it wouldn't be your money to keep. It would belong to the "commune" of siblings and divided in the name of fairness.

That's the issue with Communism. There is no incentive to do better. It might be fair, but it doesn't really make people happy.
 
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Do you have an siblings? Imagine having an identical twin. Things should be equal being the same age/sex and growing up in the same family. But what happens after you get jobs and leave home?

Would you want mom and dad to take money that one of you had earned and give it to the other if he or she made less? Over time, neither one of you would want to put in any effort, because it wouldn't be your money to keep. It would belong to the "commune" of siblings and divided in the name of fairness.

That's the issue with Communism. There is no incentive to do better. It might be fair, but it doesn't really make people happy.
What's your idea then? Let crony capitalism run amok? Does it make people happy?
 
What's your idea then? Let crony capitalism run amok? Does it make people happy?
Let people enjoy their individualism and liberty. Freedom comes with responsibility, but it's worth it.

The attitude of "it's not fair" sounds like something children say. I don't know how much experience you have with parenting, but every parent gets to hear that. The usual response is "Who ever said it was supposed to be?" Eventually they grow up and stop expecting mom and dad to make the universe play fair.

I see a lack of maturity in the Marxist rioters. They don't really want "fair", they want "easy". Life is neither of those things. But that's how you grow and mature. You take responsibility for yourself, maybe even have a family someday. You smell the roses and pet cats along the way. The universe doesn't owe you anything. You owe it to yourself to get out there and live. Happiness is just one of many experiences that are valuable.


"There is a crack, a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in
" ~ Leonard Cohen
 
P

Philemon

Let people enjoy their individualism and liberty. Freedom comes with responsibility, but it's worth it.

The attitude of "it's not fair" sounds like something children say. I don't know how much experience you have with parenting, but every parent gets to hear that. The usual response is "Who ever said it was supposed to be?" Eventually they grow up and stop expecting mom and dad to make the universe play fair.

I see a lack of maturity in the Marxist rioters. They don't really want "fair", they want "easy". Life is neither of those things. But that's how you grow and mature. You take responsibility for yourself, maybe even have a family someday. You smell the roses and pet cats along the way. The universe doesn't owe you anything. You owe it to yourself to get out there and live. Happiness is just one of many experiences that are valuable.


"There is a crack, a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in
" ~ Leonard Cohen
I see a lack of maturity in the ego-maniacal, narcissistic plutocrats and kleptocrats who undemocratically determine how life is lived in this world. I also see a lack of maturity in your continuing to construe legitimate criticism of economic disparities as childish whining from "Marxist rioters." If you don't want to look Evil in the eye and recognize that our economic arrangement is awash in it, fine. Of course we can all take personal responsibility for our lives. We pet cats and smell roses, too. But that doesn't mean that any of us, for one moment, should lose sight of the fact that the power elite are dictating how the rest of us live, undemocratically.
 
I see a lack of maturity in the ego-maniacal, narcissistic plutocrats and kleptocrats who undemocratically determine how life is lived in this world. I also see a lack of maturity in your continuing to construe legitimate criticism of economic disparities as childish whining from "Marxist rioters." If you don't want to look Evil in the eye and recognize that our economic arrangement is awash in it, fine. Of course we can all take personal responsibility for our lives. We pet cats and smell roses, too. But that doesn't mean that any of us, for one moment, should lose sight of the fact that the power elite are dictating how the rest of us live, undemocratically.
And does rioting change that? Does it hurt the power elite? Or does it kill children and hurt people whose neighborhoods have been destroyed?

From where I stand, it only feeds the power elite and hurts the innocent. Talk about unfairness.
 
P

Philemon

While I am sympathetic to these types of worker/societal issues, don't we have to be fair and point out how much the quality of life has actually advanced in recent centuries through this type of shared sacrifice?

While folks might niggle at the edges of this notion, Western society spends more time now than ever in leisure activities, has more access to literature/art/music (digital age has broken this wide open), etc.

So, is this "good" is the result of "evil" or are we risking painting with too broad a brush?
I think it's fair to recognize what has been accomplished in terms of improving quality of life, but we can't let recognition of progress be a thought stopper as to what further progress must be made. As an American, I live within "Western society" but much of non-US Western society has greater leisure opportunities than those of us here. They have better healthcare and better personal protections - a better social safety net, which communicates to a citizen something about the inherent worth of their life (or lack of it).

My ancestors included coal miners who had to spend their earnings at the company store (at least two of which died of black lung within days of one another, creating lasting family trauma and poverty), soldiers in nearly every war going back to the American Revolution and Civil War (Union Army), and PA Dutch non-slave owning farmers who eventually gave up their culture and language during WWII due to persecution of German Americans. I argue on behalf of greater economic equality in part because of the sacrifices they gave. They deserved better. We deserve better. Better is possible - very possible.
 
I think it's fair to recognize what has been accomplished in terms of improving quality of life, but we can't let recognition of progress be a thought stopper as to what further progress must be made. As an American, I live within "Western society" but much of non-US Western society has greater leisure opportunities than those of us here. They have better healthcare and better personal protections - a better social safety net, which communicates to a citizen something about the inherent worth of their life (or lack of it).

My ancestors included coal miners who had to spend their earnings at the company store (at least two of which died of black lung within days of one another, creating lasting family trauma and poverty), soldiers in nearly every war going back to the American Revolution and Civil War (Union Army), and PA Dutch non-slave owning farmers who eventually gave up their culture and language during WWII due to persecution of German Americans. I argue on behalf of greater economic equality in part because of the sacrifices they gave. They deserved better. We deserve better. Better is possible - very possible.
Sure people can do better. MLK and Gandhi successfully used non-violent protests to create positive changes in the world. That actually worked. But race riots every 4 years in the US isn't helping anyone. Why not try what works?
 
P

Philemon

And does rioting change that? Does it hurt the power elite? Or does it kill children and hurt people whose neighborhoods have been destroyed?

From where I stand, it only feeds the power elite and hurts the innocent. Talk about unfairness.
I haven't been a part of the riots. I haven't condoned them, either. I don't know anyone who has been part of them. But, from what I've seen on TV, it mostly looks like teenagers and twenty-somethings. Perhaps if meaningful work with fair pay were more readily available to these individuals they would be pursuing dreams and goals through legitimate means rather than looting and rioting. I think the looting and rioting is a symptom of the decay of our society - not the cause of it.
 
I haven't been a part of the riots. I haven't condoned them, either. I don't know anyone who has been part of them. But, from what I've seen on TV, it mostly looks like teenagers and twenty-somethings. Perhaps if meaningful work with fair pay were more readily available to these individuals they would be pursuing dreams and goals through legitimate means rather than looting and rioting. I think the looting and rioting is a symptom of the decay of our society - not the cause of it.
No wonder they fell under the influence of an evil cult!

 
I think it's fair to recognize what has been accomplished in terms of improving quality of life, but we can't let recognition of progress be a thought stopper as to what further progress must be made. As an American, I live within "Western society" but much of non-US Western society has greater leisure opportunities than those of us here. They have better healthcare and better personal protections - a better social safety net, which communicates to a citizen something about the inherent worth of their life (or lack of it).

My ancestors included coal miners who had to spend their earnings at the company store (at least two of which died of black lung within days of one another, creating lasting family trauma and poverty), soldiers in nearly every war going back to the American Revolution and Civil War (Union Army), and PA Dutch non-slave owning farmers who eventually gave up their culture and language during WWII due to persecution of German Americans. I argue on behalf of greater economic equality in part because of the sacrifices they gave. They deserved better. We deserve better. Better is possible - very possible.
That is exactly why you should not want a revolution, or want the mobs to win right now. They are interested in one thing - POWER. If they win, sure you will put some new people in power, but they will start off just as brutal, and arbitrary as those that killed your ancestors. For example they will be harsh towards hard working white people who vote for Trump - people like your ancestors. They won't end up killing them for being white, but killing them for having the wrong ideas.

Some men in Eastern Europe wanted to fight Nazi Germany, and for one reason or another they signed up with the Western forces. When they went home victorious, many of them were jailed of harassed - some died of their treatment - because they helped defeat the Nazis, but from the wrong side. The Communists wanted to claim the whole victory for Russian forces.

David
 
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