Trump Consciousness

How do we go about establishing what it is you believe to be a superior system? How does this new system insulate itself against corruption?
I think that is an excellent question - I mean, I am sure the people who set up the US constitution thought they were doing exactly that. However, all systems corrode with time. The US system has been corroded by lobbyists with enormous budgets, and a media that seems to have been bought somehow or other. Also standards generally have fallen through the floor.

David
 
Fair enough. I'm as pollyannish as anyone, but my point regarding our system in the U.S. is that its the best we've seen to date in actual practice. Doesn't seem feasible to make a wholesale change, but I'll listen to options. We have to stay grounded in reality and practicality, right?
The best for whom? And for the Earth? I refer you to the principles of indigenous cultures who may well be 'pollyannish' as show high degrees of happiness and success, for many thousands of years, until our culture invaded. This does not mean that I just wish everyone would be nice, but that many of our societies ills are derived from neurotic, self-centred and destructive 'ideologies'. Our culture too, is made up of the disparate individuals within it, who seem to have no grounding philosophy to draw on, and a hugely contentious disposition.
 
I think that is an excellent question - I mean, I am sure the people who set up the US constitution thought they were doing exactly that. However, all systems corrode with time. The US system has been corroded by lobbyists with enormous budgets, and a media that seems to have been bought somehow or other. Also standards generally have fallen through the floor.

David
Agree - I would like to expand on this

Lobbying is, to me, "legalized" bribery.

Corporate controlled media is politically motivated and most involved are ethically bankrupt.

The co-opting of education is the primary culprit with regards to disappearance of the requirement by the public that standards of conduct be upheld by the media and of course, all aspects of society where standards used to exist.

IMO, at least here in the US, we are toast. This indeed impacts (negatively) the world.
 
The best for whom? And for the Earth? I refer you to the principles of indigenous cultures who may well be 'pollyannish' as show high degrees of happiness and success, for many thousands of years, until our culture invaded. This does not mean that I just wish everyone would be nice, but that many of our societies ills are derived from neurotic, self-centred and destructive 'ideologies'. Our culture too, is made up of the disparate individuals within it, who seem to have no grounding philosophy to draw on, and a hugely contentious disposition.
Best for whom? And for the Earth? Were those rhetorical or are we going to have a fair and serious discussion?

I'm not sure how you square the indigenous cultures you reference with the advancements modern societies have made on a wide array of quality of life measures. Fewer people live in poverty globally today than at any time in history. Literacy rates are at all time highs. People live longer. People are healthier. I know you've seen these statistics before as they're all over the internet.

Again, I'm not painting things as a panacea as they clearly are not. I'm asking what alternative system would catapult us from here.
 
Agree - I would like to expand on this

Lobbying is, to me, "legalized" bribery.
Well I guess there was originally some justification. E.g. some trades might be adversely affected by some proposed change in the law. However as it has developed, you are correct.
Corporate controlled media is politically motivated and most involved are ethically bankrupt.

The co-opting of education is the primary culprit with regards to disappearance of the requirement by the public that standards of conduct be upheld by the media and of course, all aspects of society where standards used to exist.

IMO, at least here in the US, we are toast.
What do you think will happen?

David
 
Well I guess there was originally some justification. E.g. some trades might be adversely affected by some proposed change in the law. However as it has developed, you are correct.

What do you think will happen?

David
A poll out today says it all -

70% of millennials say they'd vote for a socialist

This is due to the education system being dominated by progressives.

This also suggests (in part) why Pelosi has capitulated to these far left progressives.
 
Ahhh but what what your comment suggests is that you are assuming because I blast progressivism, I am automatically for the right (or its hijacked version). If you have to label me, put me down as Libertarian and fiscally conservative. Put me down for "small government," and big on striving to meet high personal standards in a framework of freedom to do so.

The goal of the controllers was well laid out by Carrol Quigley over 50 years ago in Tragedy and Hope.

And for a contemporary short piece - here ya go -

They Live, We Sleep: Beware the Growing Evil in Our Midst

Quigley stated the goal was globlaization and socialism. In focusing on the US, part of the process to get there would be for the uber- wealthy, through tax free foundations to create the text books of the education system. Look at where the US now stands in the world in subjects that matter like math, all types of engineering and education in general.

And look at how the education system is structured where you can be set for life if you achieve professorship (and ultimately full professorship). Who funds this system? Grants from these same foundations, wealthy parents who achieve and maintain their wealth through a financial system whose goal is fascism (from the article above by John Whitehead - Fascism is "a form of government where private corporate interests rule, money calls the shots, and the people are seen as mere subjects to be controlled"), and through "educating" (actually indoctrinating) the youth about the "evil rich" (which, for many, the case can be made) and that the solution is "tax the hell out of them" which always turns into a massive tax over all save the significant portion of the masses who can't or don't work who, as a collective, are thrown a pittance relative to what the corporations end up maintaining. This is the smoke and mirrors game being played and progressives only play their mostly unwitting role but at this moment in time, their role accelerates the achievement of the inevitable. I, admittedly selfishly, prefer the illusion of freedom I hold today to last a little longer. At least I am honest.

FYI - I love Jimmy Dore and watch him often.

Did you know Maria Bartiromo is a member of the CFR. She's just playing her role. The goal is to get the masses so pissed off at the current version of the ones in power that there's a voter revolt which will hand the reins of power to the progressives. That's all this is about. With the youth clearly mesmerized and that attempts to fill the voting bins with voters that don't have the right to vote (this is what all the open borders BS is all about and Texas is the primary target, turn Texas blue and mission is accomplished). And once the progressives take control (if they can get a majority in all three branches) they will go nuclear option in the Senate on everything and they will expand the supreme court and appoint radical progressives. They will then make sure they win 8 years later just to make sure that in 12 to 16 years, the entire judiciary, save for a few, will be packed with radical progressives.

That's why we're toast in the US and good hearted but naive progressives are playing their role perfectly.

I hold to the wish, dream and desire the future incarnations of my loved ones and myself are either not here on future Earth or are on some other world where "the State" is run by people who understand, life without liberty is actually no life at all.
 
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All I say is that socialism must have something going for it because the establishment’s both here in the UK and the US seem absolutely terrified of it gaining ground. ;)
I agree in part with what you say, Steve... that "the establishment" is terrified of it. To explore this I must carefully define what I mean by the term, "the establishment." To me, "the establishment" is those who are vested in a continuation of the status quo. And when an observer sees the "political affiliation" sub divisions of this establishment one can "see" two groups, those that appear to back "the right" and those who appear to back "the left." But make no mistake, the goal is that the status quo remain while they position themselves for the future which they are certain will be in full bloom within a generation or so.

What socialism has going for it is the momentum it gains from the fact that as the elite solidify their separate, well protected world within the grander Earth centered world, as in Huxley's Brave New World, more and more and more of the masses sense, feel, perceive (via massively manipulated corporate controlled media) that the evils being perpetrated upon the US as the last stand of those deluded into believing they are "free" are from a "dark right wing, even "alt-right" right and this will culminate in exactly as I stated above.

By then, the top several tiers of the elite (which are about 1% of the world population, will have secured their wealth and position as world controllers and that's when what "socialism" has going for it as the only option left for the masses becomes so greatly screamed for by the masses, the system gets implemented in full force (the US is already quite "socialismed up") and when the US falls, the dominoes fall in the rest of the western world. What it will end up becoming is much like what you see in China today but even worse as far as "free speech" and "human rights" and the freedom to think outside the confines of the box the masses will be placed in.

Yep, Brave New World and 1984 (Orwell) were not just prescient... they were revelatory of an ages old plan. Those who scream for socialism today are simply accelerating the implementation of the inevitable.

Trump was (is) a tiny glimmer of hope to those who wish, deep in their heart, their children and children's children might have a shot at experiencing the vestiges of freedom but sadly it is all too obvious that besides the fact he's a flawed human being (who isn't, certainly I am) but has been compromised long ago by the factions (most not even realizing their role) that have surrounded him and taken control of his presidency, he knows he's in over his head. IMO he's running for term 2 out of pure ego and he has an out that appeases his conscience... if he doesn't win, he can try and take down a few folks, a few factions with him. Also, by winning a second term, he thinks he can delay what will happen to his financial empire and his family. They will be completely destroyed so as to send a message to any other would be "saviors," "Never, ever, think you can jump into our rigged game and not play ball exactly as we tell you... ever, ever again." That's the primary opportunity the controllers see with regards to Trump. Realize, the controllers always have their plans well mapped out regardless who wins national elections of major and even mid level and minor countries.

Trump calls these "deep state" attacks as witch hunts (which they are) and coup attempts (which they are). What he knows but hasn't revealed to his followers is that he foolishly didn't want to believe that the actual coup began long, long ago. Milestone events like the JFK assassination and 9/11 notwithstanding, the march to a one world global centralized government that positions a separate self deified elite in control of the masses, in control of it all... is in its final stages. Enjoy.
 
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Understand "the establishment" is one of the useful sub divisions of the visible power structure of the controlling elite. They are playing their role well (some even wittingly while they secure their futures, ie. the futures of their descendants). Note, some of these folks come from ancestries that not only believed in reincarnation, but that these reincarnations occur within bloodlines. Still, some of these establishment folk are fearful they won't see the new reality in full emergence before their own death. Soros recently revealed this very concern. Also note, Soros was a full blown savior complex which he revealed in straight forward ways in past interviews. Soros is a perfect example of a top tier henchman of the controllers.

I can't read his mind, but I would bet he is convinced the end game goals will occur anyways, but he's frustrated that the odds are increasing he won't see this in his lifetime. Oh, well.
 
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A poll out today says it all -

70% of millennials say they'd vote for a socialist

This is due to the education system being dominated by progressives.

This also suggests (in part) why Pelosi has capitulated to these far left progressives.
Hi Sam

It is maybe pertinent here to note the 2019 UN World Happiness Report shows some interesting results - you can download it here - https://s3.amazonaws.com/happiness-report/2019/WHR19.pdf

The US ranks #19. Ahead of it are Australia at #11, Austria at #10 [take out a few letters an you get a higher score -grrr!], Canada at #9, New Zealand at #8 [flaming kiwis - always think they are better], Sweden at #7, Switzerland at #6, the Nederlands at #5, Iceland at #4, Norway at #3, Denmark at #2 and Finland at #2.

It seems the more socialist a country is the happier its people are. Now here I mean a democratic socialism, not the faux fig leaf that covers despotism and attempts to dignify it all as [strange] both 'democratic' and 'socialist' while being neither.

BTW I think the only reason that Pelosi has 'capitulated' to progressives is that she recognises that the Democratic Party is a broad church. Education systems tend to be dominated by progressives [unless they are private] because the bulk of educated folk tend to be left of centre, and [sadly] those involved in education tend to be way left of centre. My main positive observation is that counters the gross extremes the other way - and we tend to get a pretty decent general mentality once real life has roughed up some the BS nonsense acquired at school.

I don't see the ultra progressive stuff as real. The idiotic elements get sorted out in the real world. Its more like a kind of incubator that throws out idea - some stick and others do not. The good bits go on to transform our culture and the stupid bits get chewed up and spat out by real life.

The problem for the Dems is that having that creative crucible on their turf is a headache if it is not managed well. Consider then other side and look at the Alt Right stuff that has become the crucible on the Republican turf. Its a case of 'You've got your looney fringe and we have ours'. Trump can't win in 2020 without the republican looney fringe. And the same might be said for the Dems.

Looney fringes won't go away - its the normal curve at work. Both parties need them - but the Republican more than the Dems at the moment. The R looney fringe voted in 2016, and made the difference - not a lot, but enough. Enough to be pandered to.

For me its a case of Progressive snowflakes or neo-Nazis - and that's not a hard choice for me, should I have to make it. I get the criticism that the Dems seem to be finding ways of losing constantly, and I think if I was a D voter in the US I probably would be tearing my hair out. Mercifully I am not. I live in Australia and I have a bunch of minor parties to vote for and ensure I encourage none of the majors.
 
I prefer not to do your homework but here's just one excellent article that directly addresses your question and gives far more then five reasons. I agree with them all.

Why Progressives Don’t Understand and are Enemies of Liberty

How can I do homework on your personal fears?? You’ve (deliberately or otherwise) misunderstood my question:


Sam, re liberty. I want to get a practical idea what you mean by it. What are five specific things you enjoy to do that you fear “progressives” will stop you from doing?
 
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