Walkout at Susan Blackmoore lecture protesting anti-religious theme.

ghost said:
I just wanted to announce officially that that lady atheist was merely spouting off completely unscientific atheist propaganda. The actual truth is that God gave us a choice to believe in Him or to be an atheist. The facts are this: the universe is finely tuned and there is only one universe. You cannot tell, with any kind of certainty, if there are an infinite number of universes that cannot sustain life (although such a proposition is hysterical at best). But God gave us free will to choose Him based upon a simple set of facts. I think that is just beautiful. Don't you all?

What does Arouet, the rational materialist, think about that?
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Ghost... Are you touting a Christian God or a kind of alien experiment/prime mover type
 
malf said:
Where? That would require an appeal to scripture, not an appeal to physics, surely?
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The universe is fine-tuned. That is a fact. We can only measure one universe. That is also a fact. The conclusion that we can draw from this is that either there is an Intelligent Designer (which makes more sense) or that somehow the Many Worlds Interpretation of quantum mechanics is true (which really doesn't make a whole lot of sense). Thus, there is most likely a Creator who created the universe. This Creator gives us the free-will to choose Him in whatever religion we choose. Am I wrong?
 
"Our willingness to accept scientific claims that are against common sense is the key to an understanding of the real struggle between science and the supernatural. We take the side of science in spite of the patent absurdity of some of its constructs, in spite of its failure to fulfill many of its extravagant promises of health and life, in spite of the tolerance of the scientific community for unsubstantiated just-so stories, because we have a prior commitment, a commitment to materialism. It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations, no matter how counterintuitive, no matter how mystifying to the uninitiated. Moreover, that materialism is absolute, for we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door."
- Richard Lewontin
 
ghost said:
The universe is fine-tuned. That is a fact. We can only measure one universe. That is also a fact. The conclusion that we can draw from this is that either there is an Intelligent Designer (which makes more sense) or that somehow the Many Worlds Interpretation of quantum mechanics is true (which really doesn't make a whole lot of sense).
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Why are you presuming those are the only two choices?
 
Sciborg_S_Patel said:
"Our willingness to accept scientific claims that are against common sense is the key to an understanding of the real struggle between science and the supernatural. We take the side of science in spite of the patent absurdity of some of its constructs, in spite of its failure to fulfill many of its extravagant promises of health and life, in spite of the tolerance of the scientific community for unsubstantiated just-so stories, because we have a prior commitment, a commitment to materialism. It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations, no matter how counterintuitive, no matter how mystifying to the uninitiated. Moreover, that materialism is absolute, for we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door."
- Richard Lewontin
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Are you posting that in response to Ghost's post that he can't imagine multiworld to be true?
 
K9! said:
You are supposed to confine all materialist, mind=brain stuff to CD. That rule is being broken.
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What an odd comment... This thread is ABOUT a "materialist"? There is no real mind=brain discussion, and the thread isn't even marked Mod+. Alex was clear that OS was an "open" forum...
 
ghost said:
The universe is fine-tuned. That is a fact. We can only measure one universe. That is also a fact. The conclusion that we can draw from this is that either there is an Intelligent Designer (which makes more sense) or that somehow the Many Worlds Interpretation of quantum mechanics is true (which really doesn't make a whole lot of sense). Thus, there is most likely a Creator who created the universe. This Creator gives us the free-will to choose Him in whatever religion we choose. Am I wrong?
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I tend to agree with this. The multiverse theory while interesting seems to be a overly complex solution to a rather simple and elegant ideal, that of a creator.
 
Forgive me for being out of touch, but is that whole "Fine Tuned" stuff true?

I never paid attention to it before as I always assumed it was just religious apologetics.
 
ghost said:
I wish Susan Blackmore would come debate with us. I'm sure we would set her straight.
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I suspect she would be thwarted by the ridiculously arbitrary posting rules.

In any event, it sounds like she has had her fill of religious types. ;)
 
malf said:
I suspect she would be thwarted by the ridiculously arbitrary posting rules.

In any event, it sounds like she has had her fill of religious types. ;)
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Are there posting rules? I haven't been following any, other than to be respectful of others here; but that is because I like you guys. :)
 
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