Brent Raynes UFOs and Native Americans |568|

[Alex]

I think Christ Consciousness is such a significant phenomenon, because it pops up so often in NDEs, yet we know the New Testament was a psyop; and even if there was a historical Jesus, then probably just some militant zealot type that the Flavians wanted to make fun of... So there's a huge discrepancy between the overwhelmingly powerful experience of Christ Consciousness vs an ahistorical or at best minor historical figure

So this surely tells us something significant about the nature of consciousness... especially what you said during the interview, about the researcher who further questioned the experiencer, and on questioning thought it actually wasn't "Jesus" that was seen...

I hope I've explained that ok :)

Yeah good stuff. I've been playing around with these ideas but never put it quite so succinctly. I mean, what you're describing is very trickster-ish... or at least that could be one interpretation of it from our limited viewpoint.

 

[Robbedigital]

I've been researching it and determined that The Three Little Pigs was a cynical ploy by brick makers to sell more bricks and that there was no historical Big Bad Wolf. ...doesn't make it any less useful to my three year old boy.

That's exactly what Big Bacon wants you to think. BBW Denial is the real psyop.

 

[Nelson]

Yeah good stuff. I've been playing around with these ideas but never put it quite so succinctly. I mean, what you're describing is very trickster-ish... or at least that could be one interpretation of it from our limited viewpoint.

Yes. And other possibilities I can think of is the subjectivity of NDEs themselves, or for instance how the Recollection of an NDE might be subjectively overlayed with meaning. I don't yet know enough about the Christ Consciousness phenomena to have an opinion.

But whatever the case, the discrepancy between the overwhelming Christ Consciousness experience and the ahistoricity/insignificant historicity of the Jesus character is surely significant...

...Esp. in terms of how consciousness (incl. possibly extended consciousness realm) is functioning - to what extent manipulation by other entities, inherent subjectivity of one's experiences in the extended consciousness realm, or experiencing some powerful generic being but during recall one projects onto with a religious/cultural overlay...

 

[Nelson]

Just throwing out some thoughts here. But are there other possibilities worth investigating? And I'm wondering how one can test the various explanations...

Btw, it is exciting though, when anomalies such as the Christ Consciousness phenomenon can be teased out and drawn attention too. The seeming anomalies are so often overlooked, but that's typically where the biggest breakthroughs in knowledge can be found!

 

[Robbedigital]

If for a minute we assume that "In the beginning there was the word and the word was with God and the word was God... .. and made all things yada yada.."... means the infinite all mighty is God, and 'The Word' is God's creator or creation-ator.
..And if we also assume that we're all here (mortal existence) for school/education.
Then, per the The Matrix theme, every life good and bad could provide various modes of growth spanning from:
A) Mortal while closely connected to God, to B) Mortal while fully disconnected from God.

How much could an immortal know about God if they don't know what's Not-God?

What value is the experience of being a saint without experience of having been the bad guy? (This reasoning leads me to believe in reincarnation.)

I imagine seeing Hitler or Mao, or Lenin in an afterlife and asking them "How did it feel to be/cause/do that much bad?"

In this context, Christ Consciousness could still be either an actual connection to a person/figure of a Creationator, or it could be the connection to the Creationators code/programming/law which rings a God-bell when we tap into it.

I wonder if the Do What Thou Wilt people are learning a lot tougher lessons here than I am. And maybe I'm just working on Relationships, or Humility, or that It's Not All About Me..

 

[Alex]

The part where he mentions that these apparitions occasionally provide some positive benefit but that it later "turns sour"... this is a very important theme in fairy folklore, angelic/demonic folklore, magic... desires can never be completely fulfilled... they can be temporarily met or displaced with another desire. A being might hand out gold nuggets for them later to turn to dirt. Someone might get healed only to have the disease later return or have some other ailment replace it. Delicious looking food might turn out to be leaves and worms.

I used to be into fundamentalist Christianity and would occasionally hear of "outpourings of the spirit" where some preacher would apparently have miracles happening all around them for a while.. healings, prophecy, manifestations, etc... but then it would eventually devolve into something corrupt... people getting "drunk in the spirit" and crawling around laughing hysterically or acting like animals... then there would be something come out about the preacher having sex with some assistant or it turned into a scam. Or sometimes the person wouldn't give into corruption, but the miraculous happenings would fade. Some cynics would say it was always a scam from the beginning, but I believe some of these movements to have a kernel of actual magical power at the center having experienced a few things myself.

There is a dream-like quality to all of this. How many dreams have you had where you get a taste of something you want but it "turns sour" or just slips away from your grasp as you're about to obtain it and you awake with a longing for it and you go back to sleep to try and finish the dream to get the thing you almost had but you just can't every quite get back there?

There is a dream-like quality in the fact that experiencers often suspend their rational mind and accept something completely absurd just as they would in a dream and only realize the absurdity of it later when they try to explain the dream.

There is a dream-like quality in that the thing you observe seems to be independent of you but could just as well be a projection of your subconscious.

UFO sightings seem to be waking shared dreams... manifestations of collective subconscious. This isn't to say they aren't also physical in some way.

Thermodynamic cycles harness heat (energy) and chaos (entropy) to do mechanical work. Your desires are like heat (energy) and your will is like chaos (entropy). You can be harnessed to do work but instead of a heat pump or a Rankine or Otto cycle you are put in some kind of psychic cycle that generates desire within you and then discharges that desire and the work output is some act of creation... some change to the timeline. The dream that gives you a taste of glory before slipping away... the healing that almost but doesn't come... the blessing that turns into a curse...

Maybe Maxwell's Demon is real...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell's_demon

nice!

 

[Alex]

If for a minute we assume that "In the beginning there was the word and the word was with God and the word was God... .. and made all things yada yada.."... means the infinite all mighty is God, and 'The Word' is God's creator or creation-ator.
..And if we also assume that we're all here (mortal existence) for school/education.
Then, per the The Matrix theme, every life good and bad could provide various modes of growth spanning from:
A) Mortal while closely connected to God, to B) Mortal while fully disconnected from God.

How much could an immortal know about God if they don't know what's Not-God?

What value is the experience of being a saint without experience of having been the bad guy? (This reasoning leads me to believe in reincarnation.)

I imagine seeing Hitler or Mao, or Lenin in an afterlife and asking them "How did it feel to be/cause/do that much bad?"

In this context, Christ Consciousness could still be either an actual connection to a person/figure of a Creationator, or it could be the connection to the Creationators code/programming/law which rings a God-bell when we tap into it.

I wonder if the Do What Thou Wilt people are learning a lot tougher lessons here than I am. And maybe I'm just working on Relationships, or Humility, or that It's Not All About Me..

Interesting thought experiment.

but I always come back to the wisdom of " be here now." I don't feel disconnected in the now. the right path seems pretty clear in the now. and I can't think of a time when I've ever encountered evil in the now.

 

[Robbedigital]

Interesting thought experiment.

but I always come back to the wisdom of " be here now." I don't feel disconnected in the now. the right path seems pretty clear in the now. and I can't think of a time when I've ever encountered evil in the now.

Agreed.
The major disconnect in that thought experiment is that in order to fully learn each new perspective Neo would also need to forget that he's Neo each time he plugs into the matrix which is not the case. The Rick and Morty "Roy" arcade clip demonstrates the depth of that aspect probably better than anyone else has in TV/Movie. Respectively, I think my thought experiment exaggerates to prove the point that it could/may prove beneficial or even required to "forget" in order to learn distinct experience via reincarnation. Not my idea, but it's being woven in with simulation language more frequently every day now.

 

[Alex]

But whatever the case, the discrepancy between the overwhelming Christ Consciousness experience and the ahistoricity/insignificant historicity of the Jesus character is surely significant...

Mostly agree. then again, you and I might be guilty of focusing on the "ahistoricity" over the actual history combined with the egregore/tulpa effects.

I think atwill had a really good point on this when he emphasizes that the bottom line of the Caesar's Messiah perspective is that we just don't know. I mean, we know that it was an OP, but we'll never know the real history.

 

[Alex]

Agreed.
The major disconnect in that thought experiment is that in order to fully learn each new perspective Neo would also need to forget that he's Neo each time he plugs into the matrix which is not the case. The Rick and Morty "Roy" arcade clip demonstrates the depth of that aspect probably better than anyone else has in TV/Movie. Respectively, I think my thought experiment exaggerates to prove the point that it could/may prove beneficial or even required to "forget" in order to learn distinct experience via reincarnation. Not my idea, but it's being woven in with simulation language more frequently every day now.

Good points. I think the exceptions are super interesting... for example, how is it that some people can go in for a hypnosis session and remember their past lives.

 

[Robbedigital]

Good points. I think the exceptions are super interesting... for example, how is it that some people can go in for a hypnosis session and remember their past lives.

Alex,
If you were given the option today while a living mortal to decide your next life and assured it won’t be the last one, and that the karma won’t stay with you - only keep the experience. But someone is needed to fill each role. Which would you choose:

1. A Buddhist who at 25y/o or so fully achieves one-ness and lives 55 more years with no entertainment of his self or ego.
2. An actual good Arch Bishop who lives an entire good Christian life.
3. A full-boar conservative veteran family man, non-religious.
4. A full-boar communist activist family man, non-religious.
5. A Mao/Hitler/Lenin level leader of historic atrocity.
6. A Prophet.
7. An agnostic (openminded, searching and loving) life-long.
8. A life-long preachy Atheist.
9. A rich man, life-long concerned mostly with riches.
10. A life-long homeless man concerned mostly with getting by.
Etc.. (Add your own if not listed)

Key aspect here is that the experience is intrinsic and not causal, meaning each is gonna happen anyway. And you’ll be jumping right in / coming off of a great life as the Alex T, loved by many..

Which experience would you choose next?

Edit/Add:
Man, don’t answer! I just thought about it and that feels creepy just thinking about it. And what if my decision now somehow carries over.. yuck!

I think the point is, This choosing might be what happens on the “other side”. And we don’t have the perspective while here (at least I don’t, I could barely think on it for a few seconds) to make that big a decision.

Edit/Add:
But if wanted to play the what-if game, I could make a guess at what Rob would choose - from an attempted 3rd person perspective.
So, in that theme (3rd person) I’d say I bet Rob would choose to be a stereotypical gay liberal activist type with overdriven personality dialed up to 11 or 12 and zero concern for outside perspective.
..Which is a terrifying thought for me, given how triggered I am by that person.
I wonder if that disposition is an indication of how much I have yet to learn about it.

In this theme (educational) I wonder if Alex would give major consideration to the Crowley dwtw path in the next life. I say this because Alex’s current disposition against the dwtw doesn’t give the appearance that it’s coming off having been/experienced it previously, but rather seems to be deeply concerned with learning on it for some sort of a higher purpose(known or unknown).

I mean this totally just for the purpose of exploring the potential characteristics of our relationship with the infinite. Not trying to Nostradamus or Dr. Phil anything.

Edit/Add:
Just noticed that each of those examples are full-on Be Here Now respectively.

 

[Nelson]

Agreed.
The major disconnect in that thought experiment is that in order to fully learn each new perspective Neo would also need to forget that he's Neo each time he plugs into the matrix which is not the case. The Rick and Morty "Roy" arcade clip demonstrates the depth of that aspect probably better than anyone else has in TV/Movie. Respectively, I think my thought experiment exaggerates to prove the point that it could/may prove beneficial or even required to "forget" in order to learn distinct experience via reincarnation. Not my idea, but it's being woven in with simulation language more frequently every day now.

That Rick & Morty clip was awesome. I've thought about it a lot since I saw it some weeks ago. Thanks again for sharing it!

 

[Nelson]

I watched Inception a couple of days ago. Fantastic film!

 

[Nelson]

Are there any other movies dealing with consciousness that you'd recommend?

Ones that stand out to me so far:
Memento, What dreams may come, The Matrix, Inception

 

[Robbedigital]

Are there any other movies dealing with consciousness that you'd recommend?

Ones that stand out to me so far:
Memento, What dreams may come, The Matrix, Inception

If you liked What Dreams May Come, you’ll like Undone. It’s a show, 2 seasons 8 episodes each. I posted the trailer a few months ago. It’s about as good as it gets for many subjects discussed here: Consciouness, NDE, OBE, Reincarn, Outside of time, spirit communication, etc..
Watching the first episode should be enough to confirm whether you’ll be into it. I’ve watched both seasons twice so far, and will again.

 

[Nelson]

If you liked What Dreams May Come, you’ll like Undone. It’s a show, 2 seasons 8 episodes each. I posted the trailer a few months ago. It’s about as good as it gets for many subjects discussed here: Consciouness, NDE, OBE, Reincarn, Outside of time, spirit communication, etc..
Watching the first episode should be enough to confirm whether you’ll be into it. I’ve watched both seasons twice so far, and will again.

Thanks! Looks intense and philosophical! :D

 

[Jack Ward]

And about Peter, Paul and Mary being "good Catholic names"... it's such an anachronism... because of course these names became well-known in the Church, because these were considered important figures by the church...

If the New Testament had characters called Schlomo, Jehudi and Batsheva then these would have become "good Catholic names"...

It's actually so obvious it's difficult to explain how stupid it is / the anachronistic headspace of Raynes to even think it was a great observation.

Exactly. That confused me as well. Its like saying, "Why are there people named Moses?" Because dah, the Bible was the number one book in European history for centuries.

 

[Jack Ward]

If you liked What Dreams May Come, you’ll like Undone. It’s a show, 2 seasons 8 episodes each. I posted the trailer a few months ago. It’s about as good as it gets for many subjects discussed here: Consciouness, NDE, OBE, Reincarn, Outside of time, spirit communication, etc..
Watching the first episode should be enough to confirm whether you’ll be into it. I’ve watched both seasons twice so far, and will again.

All great choices. There's a fascinating interview with Richard Matheson's son who is an atheist and the struggle he had with his father because he thought his father had "silly ideas" about the afterlife and spirituality.
"The Congress" is a very powerful flick as it marries the whole trans-humanism and consciousness together in creepy ways.

 

[Jack Ward]

Thanks! Looks intense and philosophical! :D

"Upload" on Prime a well - despite it's flaws- has some great conversations about the trans-human debate and what it would ACTUALLY be like.
J

 

[Nelson]

Exactly. That confused me as well. Its like saying, "Why are there people named Moses?" Because dah, the Bible was the number one book in European history for centuries.

Glad someone else noticed this too)
Cheers also for the recommendations!