Coronavirus Pandemic

Another thing that seems very odd to me is out of the different doctors who either agree with this vaccine and it's current implementation, or dont agree, how can they be able to give their approval if nobody even knows what the ingredients are? am i missing something?
 
On the face of it, this looks to be an awful decision and highlights the dangers of strict adherence to an ideology.



https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowb...eports-NSW-council-shot-dead-rescue-dogs.html

Daily Mail said:
According to multiple reports in the media on Monday, the council shot dead several impounded dogs, prompting a government probe into the incident.

They apparently shot the animals to prevent volunteers at a Cobar-based shelter 90 minutes away from travelling to pick them up amid strict lockdown restrictions.
 
On the face of it, this looks to be an awful decision and highlights the dangers of strict adherence to an ideology.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowb...eports-NSW-council-shot-dead-rescue-dogs.html

This isn't a criticism, but an observation (realistically we probably all have the same reaction to the thought of some dogs killed unnecessarily). But it is quite amazing that we can get upset about this, but we don't get upset about the hundreds of thousands of completely unnecessary COVID-19 deaths. Quite the opposite - no number of "lives saved" can be assumed to offset the inconvenience of a lockdown of your local coffee shop.

I wonder what this whole pandemic would have looked like if humans were passing on COVID-19 to their pets, and it was the dogs who were dying.
 
People are getting imposed upon really badly in Oz not that it isn't terrible elsewhere. I think Oz is in a way a blueprint of what 'they' want to role out in the first world (god help people in parts of the third world)
Is the number on this true? gives me a little hope in medical doctors
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This isn't a criticism, but an observation (realistically we probably all have the same reaction to the thought of some dogs killed unnecessarily). But it is quite amazing that we can get upset about this, but we don't get upset about the hundreds of thousands of completely unnecessary COVID-19 deaths. Quite the opposite - no number of "lives saved" can be assumed to offset the inconvenience of a lockdown of your local coffee shop.

I wonder what this whole pandemic would have looked like if humans were passing on COVID-19 to their pets, and it was the dogs who were dying.

I know what you are saying, but I think you are missing the point.

It's upsetting because it was irrationally and stupidly done in the name of COVID, from which, many have been highlighting the dangers associated with such a mentality if taken too far. People can do horrible things if they are given the right circumstances to do so, and this has been seen all throughout history in war and times of calamity.

Yes COVID has killed people, but this was a deliberate act, and one made by morons. I think that worries people, because we know these types are out there, and in positions of authority. Who knows what other crazy things will happen in OZ.

Majority opinion now seems to be in the UK that what is happening down under is a disaster and an authoritarian nightmare. Especially since we have pretty much started to move on since we opened up. No-one cares anymore about COVID. And to see what is happening in OZ gives a stark contrast.
 
Hate to state the obvious but giving trillions of bucks to psychopaths (imo) to 'do what they wilt' with in US 'infrastructure' bill is not going to end well. This post is shitting understatements.
 
I know what you are saying, but I think you are missing the point.

It's upsetting because it was irrationally and stupidly done in the name of COVID, from which, many have been highlighting the dangers associated with such a mentality if taken too far. People can do horrible things if they are given the right circumstances to do so, and this has been seen all throughout history in war and times of calamity.

Yes COVID has killed people, but this was a deliberate act, and one made by morons. I think that worries people, because we know these types are out there, and in positions of authority. Who knows what other crazy things will happen in OZ.

Majority opinion now seems to be in the UK that what is happening down under is a disaster and an authoritarian nightmare. Especially since we have pretty much started to move on since we opened up. No-one cares anymore about COVID. And to see what is happening in OZ gives a stark contrast.

Problem is, COVID doesn't know or care if you're trying to do a good deed. All it sees is more opportunity for transmission. So people dying because of the increased transmission of COVID? No one cares. But the death of a few dogs? Authoritarian nightmare.
 
But do you not find it disturbing that the thought process of someone who's interpretation of covid regulations was to shoot dogs because they didn't want anyone to go and tend to them?


It's pretty damn extreme, and that is the part that bothers me so much because that type of decision making could expand in ways you really don't want it to.

They really didn't need to do that.
 
But do you not find it disturbing that the thought process of someone who's interpretation of covid regulations was to shoot dogs because they didn't want anyone to go and tend to them?


It's pretty damn extreme, and that is the part that bothers me so much because that type of decision making could expand in ways you really don't want it to.

They really didn't need to do that.
It starts with dogs. They learn to steel their hearts. Then........
 
But do you not find it disturbing that the thought process of someone who's interpretation of covid regulations was to shoot dogs because they didn't want anyone to go and tend to them?

It's pretty damn extreme, and that is the part that bothers me so much because that type of decision making could expand in ways you really don't want it to.

They really didn't need to do that.
Euthanizing dogs is something that already happens in dog pounds, when a home cannot be found for them - in this case, a home locally due to travel restrictions (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ncil-LYING-homing-dogs-animals-shot-dead.html). Yes, it's a sad situation, but it's hardly a novel or extreme occurrence. I wish it could have been handled differently, but I'm not sure how you draw the line without creating equally or more heart wrenching stories.

Is this the trade-off we are comfortable with? Don't enforce travel restrictions during a pandemic. We're comfortable if many people die, but not if a few dogs die.
 
I feel like you are completely missing the context here, and missing the point I am trying to make.

They were only shot because they didn't want the staff to travel up and collect them. It wasn't because it was a normal situation e.g. the normal euthanising, but because of COVID.

I am not drawing any line btw. I am just making a point that the decision making process is terrible in this context. That is what annoys and worries me. You are reading too much into what I said and building up a little bit of a strawman to then knock down with the whole creating more heart wrenching stories. Like how would that even happen?

Enforcing travel restrictions by shooting dead dogs so that people can't collect them anymore is pretty weird and I've clearly laid out how I feel about that.
 
I feel like you are completely missing the context here, and missing the point I am trying to make.

They were only shot because they didn't want the staff to travel up and collect them. It wasn't because it was a normal situation e.g. the normal euthanising, but because of COVID.

The article I linked about the incident stated that the dogs were euthanized because they had been unable to rehome the dogs locally, and they couldn't keep the dogs any longer (pens at capacity and two dogs were aggressive towards staff).

I am not drawing any line btw. I am just making a point that the decision making process is terrible in this context. That is what annoys and worries me. You are reading too much into what I said and building up a little bit of a strawman to then knock down with the whole creating more heart wrenching stories. Like how would that even happen?

Enforcing travel restrictions by shooting dead dogs so that people can't collect them anymore is pretty weird and I've clearly laid out how I feel about that.

I didn't mean to build up a straw man. I agree that it was unfortunate that the council initially ignored the 5km restriction and contacted the Cobar animal shelter, then later changed their minds about upholding the restriction and took it back. I think that was handled poorly. But the outcome would have been the same if they hadn't contacted them in the first place.
 
This isn't a criticism, but an observation (realistically we probably all have the same reaction to the thought of some dogs killed unnecessarily). But it is quite amazing that we can get upset about this, but we don't get upset about the hundreds of thousands of completely unnecessary COVID-19 deaths. Quite the opposite - no number of "lives saved" can be assumed to offset the inconvenience of a lockdown of your local coffee shop.

I wonder what this whole pandemic would have looked like if humans were passing on COVID-19 to their pets, and it was the dogs who were dying.

People wouldn’t be willing to close the economy for two years even if it put their dogs at a slightly higher risk of dying over the course of those couple of years. I can guarantee you that.

Besides, it’s more complicated. There’s good arguments in favor of lockdowns causing other additional deaths via loss of health insurance, declining mental health, stress, and poverty, increased domestic abuse and violence etc. etc. Those are all big indicators and factors leading to additional deaths.

Don’t get me wrong, I wear a mask and got the vaccine. But I’ve always been generally opposed to the lockdowns. I was talking about the potential pitfalls of lockdowns around day one. And people on Facebook were calling me essentially a murderer. Months later all the stores are now open and all these same people are going to them. Not only that, we’re packing tens of thousands of people into sporting events etc. People went home for Christmas and Thanksgiving. Many of the people doing this were the same people calling me a murderer for my musings. And people were doing these things when the case load was much higher than it was in the beginning, when the strict lockdowns actually did occur. All I was saying in the beginning was allow Aunt Mary to continue operating her Pretzel shop.

I’m just musing here without fully understanding your point or position. For that I apologize. But I do agree that the dog analogy can sometimes be useful. Sometimes I wonder what people would feel like if dogs were forced into tiny rooms in meat factories while their psychological and physical welfare are totally ignored for months or years before their meat is harvested, as is the case with pigs and cows. There would be total outrage.
 
I feel like you are completely missing the context here, and missing the point I am trying to make.

They were only shot because they didn't want the staff to travel up and collect them. It wasn't because it was a normal situation e.g. the normal euthanising, but because of COVID.

I am not drawing any line btw. I am just making a point that the decision making process is terrible in this context. That is what annoys and worries me. You are reading too much into what I said and building up a little bit of a strawman to then knock down with the whole creating more heart wrenching stories. Like how would that even happen?

Enforcing travel restrictions by shooting dead dogs so that people can't collect them anymore is pretty weird and I've clearly laid out how I feel about that.
I find shooting - as opposed to the normal method of euthanizing - to be peculiar and somehow disturbing. I'm no stranger to guns, shooting and even killing, but in this context it is pure weird.
 
Months later all the stores are now open and all these same people are going to them. Not only that, we’re packing tens of thousands of people into sporting events etc. People went home for Christmas and Thanksgiving. Many of the people doing this were the same people calling me a murderer for my musings. And people were doing these things when the case load was much higher than it was in the beginning, when the strict lockdowns actually did occur.

I think a reasonable discussion could be had about lockdowns, but at this point it's too politicized to be reasonable - especially on this forum. Your example illustrates one important issue in its favor, though.

Lockdowns and mandates are a non-conscious signal to "take this stuff seriously", and conversely, the lifting of lockdowns and mandates signals that we don't need to worry about it. And this signal obviously over-rides any good intentions. Because you're right. If this was about doing the right thing, then our behavior now should be similar to our behavior at the beginning. Instead, the situation is worse than it ever was at the beginning, in my area. And nobody is doing anything about it.
 
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