Jason Jorjani. Does AI = PSI? |589|

Well, I finally finished the "Closer encounters".

First, the good things: the print is of good quality and the book contains plenty of juicy UFO stories. Too bad all those stories are from other sources, while Jorjani’s contribution is, to quote himself is “Sad, so sad. Pathetic, actually.” (p 434.).

A credit should be given to Jorjani’s knack for obfuscating his mediocrity as a thinker and a scholar. Yes, there are plenty of examples that he cites with endless “Ibid”s, (i.e., giving numerous uninterrupted citations from the same source), but don’t expect a fair representation of the source, nor does he bother providing alternative explanations of the phenomena. Yet, he conveniently makes dubious statements as facts without providing any references or arguments to support them. For example, talking about the pillar of cloud in Exodus (p.283): “We can confidently identify this ‘cloud’-like aura as the ionization effect produced by the electro-magnetic propulsion system.” Would be great to have a reference to support such confidence, especially that in the very next paragraph he says: “there is one particular night when the object does not emit its usual fiery glow”. But, but muh electro-magnetic propulsion system?!

He loves sciency terms but does not understand how idiotic they sound, such as a “mercury-thorium isotope” and “an amount of energy equivalent to the volume of a coffee cup” (both p.111). He apparently thinks that Sun and Moon “set at the opposite points of the horizon at solstices” (p.217), i.e., one in the West and the other in the East (must be something to behold!).

What about Jorjani’s ability to think and support his points of view? Same story. His main contention is that Nazis developed zero point energy (ZPE) at the end of the war, which also allows time travel (because Jorjani with his deep understanding of science says so); they travel back in time to change the past to their liking, they are the Nordics, and since they are Nazis, we are doomed, unless we employ another evil (unfathomable according to some, such as Cthulhu), such that that evil destroys Nazis/Nordics and 99% or so of the population, because, you see, it is worth it as it will free “us” (i.e.,. those similar to Jorjani) from another evil. Makes sense?

What kind of arguments does he have for the Nazi time travel? Only fallacies a la guilt by association, such as, “What were they moving around on private trains that ran along all of those American rail lines they owned?” (p.100) “Would they have landed on all those acres acquired in Argentina by Prussian corporate colonists?” (p.103) He thinks that JP Morgan was behind the late 19th century American UFOs, because one of the UFOnauts told a witness that they are financed by somebody in NY. To Jorjani it means JP Morgan, never mind the deceptive nature of UFOs and that NJMZa was operational when Morgan was not of much importance yet. But, but, yes, it must be the time travel! Fine, let’s assume it is time traveling Nazis. Apparently, instead of impressing everybody with their tech at the end of the war, they dumped themselves on Mars some 300 or whatever million years back. Just because why not. Did it do them any good? Well, they nuked themselves and blew the Mars atmosphere off in the process.

What about the “savior”, the Trickster? Well, he may kill people for fun, mutilate cattle, etc., but it is all good, because he is the Trickster. Nazis, who do similar nasty things are not the Trickster, so they are bad, but the Trickster is good. Got it? What is this Trickster? It is a time-traveling octopus species from the distant future with magical powers such as the ability to change “color and texture instantly because its neurons are connected directly to millions of pixel-like sacks in its skin. The octopus is like a CRISPR genetic engineer who could recode not just the colors but also the texture of its skin.” (p.366). Impressive? Jorjani apparently never heard of goose bumps. Also, there are Grays, but they are not Nordic Grays, because they are owls, OK? And so on…

To sum up: Jorjani sucks as a thinker and only muddles the waters, either on purpose or just because he is that simple. Marty Garza on The Brothers of the Serpent podcast gives a much deeper and nuanced overview of the UFO phenomena, and of course there are plenty of other, much better books on the subject. Even the Illuminatus! trilogy provides a better insight into what it could be about plus being much more entertaining and wild.
 
Well, I finally finished the "Closer encounters".

First, the good things: the print is of good quality and the book contains plenty of juicy UFO stories. Too bad all those stories are from other sources, while Jorjani’s contribution is, to quote himself is “Sad, so sad. Pathetic, actually.” (p 434.).

A credit should be given to Jorjani’s knack for obfuscating his mediocrity as a thinker and a scholar. Yes, there are plenty of examples that he cites with endless “Ibid”s, (i.e., giving numerous uninterrupted citations from the same source), but don’t expect a fair representation of the source, nor does he bother providing alternative explanations of the phenomena. Yet, he conveniently makes dubious statements as facts without providing any references or arguments to support them. For example, talking about the pillar of cloud in Exodus (p.283): “We can confidently identify this ‘cloud’-like aura as the ionization effect produced by the electro-magnetic propulsion system.” Would be great to have a reference to support such confidence, especially that in the very next paragraph he says: “there is one particular night when the object does not emit its usual fiery glow”. But, but muh electro-magnetic propulsion system?!

He loves sciency terms but does not understand how idiotic they sound, such as a “mercury-thorium isotope” and “an amount of energy equivalent to the volume of a coffee cup” (both p.111). He apparently thinks that Sun and Moon “set at the opposite points of the horizon at solstices” (p.217), i.e., one in the West and the other in the East (must be something to behold!).

What about Jorjani’s ability to think and support his points of view? Same story. His main contention is that Nazis developed zero point energy (ZPE) at the end of the war, which also allows time travel (because Jorjani with his deep understanding of science says so); they travel back in time to change the past to their liking, they are the Nordics, and since they are Nazis, we are doomed, unless we employ another evil (unfathomable according to some, such as Cthulhu), such that that evil destroys Nazis/Nordics and 99% or so of the population, because, you see, it is worth it as it will free “us” (i.e.,. those similar to Jorjani) from another evil. Makes sense?

What kind of arguments does he have for the Nazi time travel? Only fallacies a la guilt by association, such as, “What were they moving around on private trains that ran along all of those American rail lines they owned?” (p.100) “Would they have landed on all those acres acquired in Argentina by Prussian corporate colonists?” (p.103) He thinks that JP Morgan was behind the late 19th century American UFOs, because one of the UFOnauts told a witness that they are financed by somebody in NY. To Jorjani it means JP Morgan, never mind the deceptive nature of UFOs and that NJMZa was operational when Morgan was not of much importance yet. But, but, yes, it must be the time travel! Fine, let’s assume it is time traveling Nazis. Apparently, instead of impressing everybody with their tech at the end of the war, they dumped themselves on Mars some 300 or whatever million years back. Just because why not. Did it do them any good? Well, they nuked themselves and blew the Mars atmosphere off in the process.

What about the “savior”, the Trickster? Well, he may kill people for fun, mutilate cattle, etc., but it is all good, because he is the Trickster. Nazis, who do similar nasty things are not the Trickster, so they are bad, but the Trickster is good. Got it? What is this Trickster? It is a time-traveling octopus species from the distant future with magical powers such as the ability to change “color and texture instantly because its neurons are connected directly to millions of pixel-like sacks in its skin. The octopus is like a CRISPR genetic engineer who could recode not just the colors but also the texture of its skin.” (p.366). Impressive? Jorjani apparently never heard of goose bumps. Also, there are Grays, but they are not Nordic Grays, because they are owls, OK? And so on…

To sum up: Jorjani sucks as a thinker and only muddles the waters, either on purpose or just because he is that simple. Marty Garza on The Brothers of the Serpent podcast gives a much deeper and nuanced overview of the UFO phenomena, and of course there are plenty of other, much better books on the subject. Even the Illuminatus! trilogy provides a better insight into what it could be about plus being much more entertaining and wild.

wow... A lot of push back... And I agree with a lot of what you're saying. Jason can play fast and loose with some of the facts. Then again, maybe you're being a little bit too harsh... Especially since he seems pretty open to constructive pushback... Which I've found to be pretty rare among folks who stick out these kind of positions.

I thought his points about ai and psi were quite original and very interesting. What do you think?

I like marty garza as well... And am publishing an interview with him next week.
 
wow... A lot of push back... And I agree with a lot of what you're saying. Jason can play fast and loose with some of the facts. Then again, maybe you're being a little bit too harsh... Especially since he seems pretty open to constructive pushback... Which I've found to be pretty rare among folks who stick out these kind of positions.

I thought his points about ai and psi were quite original and very interesting. What do you think?

I like marty garza as well... And am publishing an interview with him next week.

Marty is AWESOME! His book will be out one day... "Stay Tuned!!!"
 
Well, I finally finished the "Closer encounters".

First, the good things: the print is of good quality and the book contains plenty of juicy UFO stories. Too bad all those stories are from other sources, while Jorjani’s contribution is, to quote himself is “Sad, so sad. Pathetic, actually.” (p 434.).

A credit should be given to Jorjani’s knack for obfuscating his mediocrity as a thinker and a scholar. Yes, there are plenty of examples that he cites with endless “Ibid”s, (i.e., giving numerous uninterrupted citations from the same source), but don’t expect a fair representation of the source, nor does he bother providing alternative explanations of the phenomena. Yet, he conveniently makes dubious statements as facts without providing any references or arguments to support them. For example, talking about the pillar of cloud in Exodus (p.283): “We can confidently identify this ‘cloud’-like aura as the ionization effect produced by the electro-magnetic propulsion system.” Would be great to have a reference to support such confidence, especially that in the very next paragraph he says: “there is one particular night when the object does not emit its usual fiery glow”. But, but muh electro-magnetic propulsion system?!

He loves sciency terms but does not understand how idiotic they sound, such as a “mercury-thorium isotope” and “an amount of energy equivalent to the volume of a coffee cup” (both p.111). He apparently thinks that Sun and Moon “set at the opposite points of the horizon at solstices” (p.217), i.e., one in the West and the other in the East (must be something to behold!).

What about Jorjani’s ability to think and support his points of view? Same story. His main contention is that Nazis developed zero point energy (ZPE) at the end of the war, which also allows time travel (because Jorjani with his deep understanding of science says so); they travel back in time to change the past to their liking, they are the Nordics, and since they are Nazis, we are doomed, unless we employ another evil (unfathomable according to some, such as Cthulhu), such that that evil destroys Nazis/Nordics and 99% or so of the population, because, you see, it is worth it as it will free “us” (i.e.,. those similar to Jorjani) from another evil. Makes sense?

What kind of arguments does he have for the Nazi time travel? Only fallacies a la guilt by association, such as, “What were they moving around on private trains that ran along all of those American rail lines they owned?” (p.100) “Would they have landed on all those acres acquired in Argentina by Prussian corporate colonists?” (p.103) He thinks that JP Morgan was behind the late 19th century American UFOs, because one of the UFOnauts told a witness that they are financed by somebody in NY. To Jorjani it means JP Morgan, never mind the deceptive nature of UFOs and that NJMZa was operational when Morgan was not of much importance yet. But, but, yes, it must be the time travel! Fine, let’s assume it is time traveling Nazis. Apparently, instead of impressing everybody with their tech at the end of the war, they dumped themselves on Mars some 300 or whatever million years back. Just because why not. Did it do them any good? Well, they nuked themselves and blew the Mars atmosphere off in the process.

What about the “savior”, the Trickster? Well, he may kill people for fun, mutilate cattle, etc., but it is all good, because he is the Trickster. Nazis, who do similar nasty things are not the Trickster, so they are bad, but the Trickster is good. Got it? What is this Trickster? It is a time-traveling octopus species from the distant future with magical powers such as the ability to change “color and texture instantly because its neurons are connected directly to millions of pixel-like sacks in its skin. The octopus is like a CRISPR genetic engineer who could recode not just the colors but also the texture of its skin.” (p.366). Impressive? Jorjani apparently never heard of goose bumps. Also, there are Grays, but they are not Nordic Grays, because they are owls, OK? And so on…

To sum up: Jorjani sucks as a thinker and only muddles the waters, either on purpose or just because he is that simple. Marty Garza on The Brothers of the Serpent podcast gives a much deeper and nuanced overview of the UFO phenomena, and of course there are plenty of other, much better books on the subject. Even the Illuminatus! trilogy provides a better insight into what it could be about plus being much more entertaining and wild.

This guy didn't read the book OR... if he did, he couldn't understand it and he got things massively confused. One or the other... Ohhhh, there's a third option. He's another disinfo agent on the reputation smear team (I actually make odds on this the highest).
 
This guy didn't read the book OR... if he did, he couldn't understand it and he got things massively confused. One or the other... Ohhhh, there's a third option. He's another disinfo agent on the reputation smear team (I actually make odds on this the highest).
@Chester Hunter, ohhhh, "this guy" did not read the book, but provided a bunch of quotes with page references, he must be magical, don't you think? ;) AND ohhh, he does not hobnob with intelligence agents, OR tries to do a billion bucks deal to finance a revolution in a country in which he did not grow up in or does not live in currently, so he must be "a disinfo agent". Brilliant! Thanks for devoting the whole THREE hypotheses to my humble person. Be well :)
 
wow... A lot of push back... And I agree with a lot of what you're saying. Jason can play fast and loose with some of the facts. Then again, maybe you're being a little bit too harsh... Especially since he seems pretty open to constructive pushback... Which I've found to be pretty rare among folks who stick out these kind of positions.

I thought his points about ai and psi were quite original and very interesting. What do you think?

I like marty garza as well... And am publishing an interview with him next week.

Being pretty open to constructive pushback is good on him. If his heart is in the right place and he really wants to figure out what is going on, he will understand. I listened to your two interviews with him and thought wow this is interesting, ideas fly around, the guy sounds knowledgable and original, etc. that's why I bought the book. And read it (even though Chester hypothesizes I did not ;)). The problem is, "playing fast and loose" is THE problem here. His style is to dump a bunch of quotes etc on you and then slip in a major postulate without any reasoning or quotes to back it up and proceed as if it is a fact. And I did not even touch anything on some more philosophical aspects of what he tries to cover. His lack of logic and understanding of science topics he is using to impress the reader is unfortunately quite obvious. What is left? An ambition to do a revolution in a (foreign to him) country and willingness to accept death and suffering of a lot of people to achieve his "philosophical" ideas?

I am not sure what you mean by his points on AI and psy. The stuff he said about AI becoming conscious will surely have psy abilities? In my book, consciousness goes with psy, yes, but AI as we now know it does not go with consciousness. You should know more about AI then I do (I only have an MIT certificate in ML), but is it not essentially a statistical model of the most probable, likely outcome of a question, i.e., an "average" of the data it is trained with? For me consciousness is nothing without creativity, while creativity is not something "average".

And thanks again for bringing Marty Garza.

AK
 
@Chester Hunter, ohhhh, "this guy" did not read the book, but provided a bunch of quotes with page references, he must be magical, don't you think? ;) AND ohhh, he does not hobnob with intelligence agents, OR tries to do a billion bucks deal to finance a revolution in a country in which he did not grow up in or does not live in currently, so he must be "a disinfo agent". Brilliant! Thanks for devoting the whole THREE hypotheses to my humble person. Be well :)

GeoDoorn... you should consider taking reading classes - "...OR... if he did, he couldn't understand it and he got things massively confused."

Obviously if you read it (which I give you enough credit to "know that") then my "OR" applies which I based upon your entire commentary.
 
Being pretty open to constructive pushback is good on him. If his heart is in the right place and he really wants to figure out what is going on, he will understand. I listened to your two interviews with him and thought wow this is interesting, ideas fly around, the guy sounds knowledgable and original, etc. that's why I bought the book. And read it (even though Chester hypothesizes I did not ;)). The problem is, "playing fast and loose" is THE problem here. His style is to dump a bunch of quotes etc on you and then slip in a major postulate without any reasoning or quotes to back it up and proceed as if it is a fact. And I did not even touch anything on some more philosophical aspects of what he tries to cover. His lack of logic and understanding of science topics he is using to impress the reader is unfortunately quite obvious. What is left? An ambition to do a revolution in a (foreign to him) country and willingness to accept death and suffering of a lot of people to achieve his "philosophical" ideas?

I am not sure what you mean by his points on AI and psy. The stuff he said about AI becoming conscious will surely have psy abilities? In my book, consciousness goes with psy, yes, but AI as we now know it does not go with consciousness. You should know more about AI then I do (I only have an MIT certificate in ML), but is it not essentially a statistical model of the most probable, likely outcome of a question, i.e., an "average" of the data it is trained with? For me consciousness is nothing without creativity, while creativity is not something "average".

And thanks again for bringing Marty Garza.

AK

An example of your own admission you don't understand something - "I am not sure what you mean by his points on AI and psy."

Case closed.
 
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