The Donald Trump Thread

Attorney General and State dept are under the executive branch. President may fire at will. How is he showing lack of respect for separation of powers?
These sorts of changeovers go really smoothly in the U.K. By the afternoon following the previous days election, the old government have all left their positions, and the new government is taking them up.

I watched Jeff Sessions hearing what seems like ages ago. It's really strange to watch an outgoing government continuing to have any ability to frustrate an incoming one.
 
X being bad doesn't make Y better, especially when there's context for why people resist gun restrictions. (Food industry one does seem down to lobbyists AFAIK.)

As David said and I referred to, probability calculations don't take into account the danger of a mass attack succeeding.

You're also assuming people have "tribal prejudices" when it seems to me they're just worried about people blowing them up or running them over with trucks.

Surely there's something in between "Islam is inherently evil" and "Fear of Islam is prejudice"? None of the ancient faiths come to us without cultural baggage (see Hinduism and gang-rape in India). If religions were video games and a good chunk of terrorist acts were done by players of a particular game, we should be able to dig into why and take some precautions to prevent future attacks.
People only resist gun restrictions because of their culture and beliefs, the food industry one I agree is because of corporate cronyism.

Right but what probability is that? I have previously provided the available risk calculations we have, and terrorism is very low. You may feel that the risk of a big attack makes all the attention it gets justifiable, but that is an opinion not backed up by the available data.

I think the fact that only Islamic terrorism is discussed shows prejudices, there was a terror attack on Muslims yesterday in Canada, it will not be viewed or treated by the same by the media or many others as if it had been a Muslim attack on a church.

I have also already said we should take some precautions, your country and mine already take massive precautions, a ban on people from certain countries is completely over the top and it makes the USA, especially with its foreign policy past, look particularly bad.
 
As you constructed the statement in bold, this is your view. Clearly, there is a large population of Americans that do not share it. They seem to be truly concerned with the potential for further terrorist attacks on domestic soil.

Its also not mutually exclusive. Its plausible and likely probable that many of these same Americans with a disproportionate concern regarding terrorism (your view) are also concerned with lethal violence between citizens.

This theme of intellectual and moral superiority from the "left" is completely counter-productive. I'm not accusing you of this at all. I am reacting to what I'm seeing via social media and other media outlets. The earlier post in this thread on the "4 easy steps" was apt in this regard.
I wasn't stating my opinion. The risk of terrorism is much, much lower then all sorts of other things that get much less attention in the media, politics, and peoples minds. Just because other people disagree doesn't change the actual risk of terrorism to them.

I don't know why people keep arguing with me about this, if you guys want to carry on letting this issue be a top priority for you, then you will live with the consequences of that.

I also don't know how you managed to bring 'the left' into this, I think the over the top hysteria about terrorism is counter productive, but hey ho.
 
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As you constructed the statement in bold, this is your view. Clearly, there is a large population of Americans that do not share it. They seem to be truly concerned with the potential for further terrorist attacks on domestic soil.

Its also not mutually exclusive. Its plausible and likely probable that many of these same Americans with a disproportionate concern regarding terrorism (your view) are also concerned with lethal violence between citizens.

This theme of intellectual and moral superiority from the "left" is completely counter-productive. I'm not accusing you of this at all. I am reacting to what I'm seeing via social media and other media outlets. The earlier post in this thread on the "4 easy steps" was apt in this regard.
My point in response to your gun control response was that if risk of death was the true concern gun control would have been implemented in America, but it it was there would be a huge backlash. So in terms of trying to keep people safe, the government and its own people often won't do what it takes to actually make them safer.
 
I wasn't stating my opinion. The risk of terrorism is much, much lower then all sorts of other things that get much less attention in the media, politics, and peoples minds. Just because other people disagree doesn't change the actual risk of terrorism to them.

I don't know why people keep arguing with me about this, if you guys want to carry on letting this issue be a top priority for you, then you will live with the consequences of that.

I also don't know how you managed to being 'the left' into this, I think the over the top hysteria about terrorism is counter productive, but hey ho.
I think you misunderstood and I likely wasn't very clear either.

You stated the amount of attention this risk is getting is "over the top". Your statement regarding the appropriate level of attention is your opinion. I know its based on the facts you have and how you interpret them, but there is no factual way to tell other people what they should or should not be worried about. That's projecting; its not "fact".

Now, you were infinitely more diplomatic than what I see on social media these days. The response I've seen is more along the lines of "Look at this chart, moron. The risk of a terrorist attack is less than you being shot by your kid." That's been the tone, at least. Completely unhelpful and does nothing more than further dig the chasm between people. There is just no compassion for differing viewpoints anymore. I'm right, they're wrong (and stupid!). Case closed. Shoot out meme's, join virtual mobs of like minded ideological "bots", and fight.

Its at least as scary as Trump, IMO. ;)
 
I think you misunderstood and I likely wasn't very clear either.

You stated the amount of attention this risk is getting is "over the top". Your statement regarding the appropriate level of attention is your opinion. I know its based on the facts you have and how you interpret them, but there is no factual way to tell other people what they should or should not be worried about. That's projecting; its not "fact".

Now, you were infinitely more diplomatic than what I see on social media these days. The response I've seen is more along the lines of "Look at this chart, moron. The risk of a terrorist attack is less than you being shot by your kid." That's been the tone, at least. Completely unhelpful and does nothing more than further dig the chasm between people. There is just no compassion for differing viewpoints anymore. I'm right, they're wrong (and stupid!). Case closed. Shoot out meme's, join virtual mobs of like minded ideological "bots", and fight.

Its at least as scary as Trump, IMO. ;)
I actually regret my last comment now - I could have been more polite.

So firstly...

Apologies for misunderstanding your last post!

I get what you mean now, I guess it is technically my view that the amount of attention it gets is over the top. I am basing that on the risk of death of terrorism compared to other things. I agree I can't tell people what to worry or not worry about - I'm just saying in terms of risk to their life, they are better off worrying about heart disease. Humans don't work like that though, and I've been guilty of being afraid of things with a very low risk to my life.

A way of stating my opinion more factually is 'compared to other things that cause the same or more deaths then terrorism or carry the same or a larger risk, terrorism takes up way more political discourse, media attention and resources'.

I agree that discourse is pretty poor right now and that chasms are being built from both sides, but some of the policies and ideas being banded about right now are very extreme and serious. And logically and compassionately challenging those ideas isn't working. Would having a reasoned debate with Richard Spencer about whether America should be an ethno state convince him? I doubt it, it may even help legitimise him and his views. Look at Sean Spicer and his responses to very legitimate reasonable questions. Don't get me started on Steve Bannon, the fact he is now so close to Trump and so high up in the government should be a great concern to us all. He is a very dangerous man, and Trump is too.
 
S

Sciborg_S_Patel

People only resist gun restrictions because of their culture and beliefs, the food industry one I agree is because of corporate cronyism.
"Only" seems a bit pat here as I think people only resist anything because of their culture and personal beliefs. :)

To be honest I probably lean more toward the gun control side though I do think the caricature of people "clinging" to guns, rather than having their own set of principles regarding gun ownership (which aligns to some extent with the argument for drug legalization) is an unfair one.
 
I agree that discourse is pretty poor right now and that chasms are being built from both sides, but some of the policies and ideas being banded about right now are very extreme and serious. And logically and compassionately challenging those ideas isn't working. Would having a reasoned debate with Richard Spencer about whether America should be an ethno state convince him? I doubt it, it may even help legitimise him and his views. Look at Sean Spicer and his responses to very legitimate reasonable questions. Don't get me started on Steve Bannon, the fact he is now so close to Trump and so high up in the government should be a great concern to us all. He is a very dangerous man, and Trump is too.
Thanks for the response and no worries on the misunderstanding. I was less than clear in my original post!

The topic I highlighted from your response above is of particular interest to me.

As someone who's been more left leaning than right my entire life, I have found myself disgusted by the "left's" behavior since the election and feeling empathy for those who voted for Trump. Especially grating for me is the intellectually superior tone that seems to be constantly evoked by the extremes on the left. (This is noteworthy as its almost, but not quite, as grating as the pre-election attacks on Obama and Hillary that were coming from the extreme right.) Its like a meme I saw recently that I instantly fell in love with: NEVER, in the history of calming down has anyone ever calmed down by being told "calm down". (I think this resonated so much from being a parent and watching first hand how ineffective this approach was with my children.)

That said a lot of what Trump is doing is, for me, potentially serious. I only say potentially as I am not as engaged in investing/research as I could be to really have confidence in either direction. However, things like Trump's handling of his business interests have been a red flag for me. Point being: You may very well be right that time may be of the essence here.

Still, I don't think we'll like the outcome if the folks fighting Trump don't change their tone and their own rhetoric. Another favorite saying I'm sure we've all heard in one variety or another is "If your mouth is moving; you aren't learning". We need, somehow, to find ways to get people engaged in thoughtful, compassionate dialogue. Sure, that doesn't resolve anything by itself but it does raise levels of respect and understanding. Two things that seem to be sorely lacking at present.

(I think we're doing a pretty good job here btw!)
 
S

Sciborg_S_Patel

As someone who's been more left leaning than right my entire life, I have found myself disgusted by the "left's" behavior since the election and feeling empathy for those who voted for Trump.
I have a friend who's black and he's actually wondered if he gets less respect from liberals when he tells them he didn't like Hilary than he would discussing with conservatives why he wouldn't vote Trump.

Basically he's "just wrong", but these same people will argue it out with other white people. It's an interesting observation, as John Greer has suggested many a Trump voter isn't interested in skin color - or at least not to the extent claimed as an explanation for Trump's victory.
 
As someone who's been more left leaning than right my entire life, I have found myself disgusted by the "left's" behavior since the election and feeling empathy for those who voted for Trump. Especially grating for me is the intellectually superior tone that seems to be constantly evoked by the extremes on the left
I've had similar thoughts as I've talked about more than once here on the forum, I've heard others say similar things. It has led me to taking a step back from my political thinking, in fact back from all political thinking. It has led me to see old friends through different eyes. I don't think any less of them, but I now recognise we have quite different thinking. This past seven months has been wild!
 
As someone who's been more left leaning than right my entire life, I have found myself disgusted by the "left's" behavior since the election and feeling empathy for those who voted for Trump. Especially grating for me is the intellectually superior tone that seems to be constantly evoked by the extremes on the left.
Maybe they are emboldened by this sort of thing:

https://www.bloomberg.com/politics/...tion-level-sharply-divides-clinton-trump-race

Maybe they have a point?
 
Sometimes labor and management have different interests. Immigration in particular, management likes low wage immigrants, labor doesn't. And high earners often will favor environmentalism and government regulation over economic growth because they don't suffer from poor economic performance. For working class voters, economic policy is not theoretical or philosophical, it can mean the difference between having enough food for their children or not. Trump appealed to working class voters because he addressed many of their legitimate concerns which they feel have been ignored for the last 8 years. Describing this as a function of education rather than economic interest is just one more in a long list of insults (Nazi, Hitler, racist, ignorant, bitter clingers, deplorables, etc) aimed at working class voters by people who openly despise them and belittle their economic suffering. It has made a fighter like Trump so popular among his supporters. Trump's unrestrained rhetoric is seen as an appropriate reply to those insults.
 
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Thanks for the response and no worries on the misunderstanding. I was less than clear in my original post!

The topic I highlighted from your response above is of particular interest to me.

As someone who's been more left leaning than right my entire life, I have found myself disgusted by the "left's" behavior since the election and feeling empathy for those who voted for Trump.
That describes me too - I am in CND, and very much in favour of the peaceful resolution of conflicts. The fact that the "Left" seemed to actually desire to aggravate Russia, was the last straw for me.
Especially grating for me is the intellectually superior tone that seems to be constantly evoked by the extremes on the left.
Agreed again. The well-off lefties find clever intellectual excuses for policies that are beneficial to themselves (though they may not be sufficiently self-aware to realise that).
That said a lot of what Trump is doing is, for me, potentially serious. I only say potentially as I am not as engaged in investing/research as I could be to really have confidence in either direction.
If you mean climate change, I don't think I would worry - by far the greatest climate risk is another ice age!

If you mean Trumps dislike of 'free trade' - well the real truth is that free trade has deprived westerners of jobs, and subjected people in poorer countries to something unpleasantly close to slavery.

I suspect that intellectual people pay for their skills by being screened off from a basic common sense that is shared by the bulk of people. I mean, if you spend much of the day studying the curvature of space near a black hole, or the thinking of an obscure medieval poet, you probably pay for that by being less savvy in other ways!

'Ordinary' people really notice the higher bills for electricity, and ask themselves who benefits from the climate change hysteria, and probably compare it with other hysteria, like the dotcom hysteria, or the hysteria over the liberalising of the banks which let them rip everyone off, etc. etc. In short, they have a finely tuned nose for the next scam that will make them poorer!
Still, I don't think we'll like the outcome if the folks fighting Trump don't change their tone and their own rhetoric. Another favourite saying I'm sure we've all heard in one variety or another is "If your mouth is moving; you aren't learning".
Yes - they need to really understand why so many people could listen to the media ridiculing Trump day after day, and still go and vote for him! (Hint - saying that the deplorable's are stupid, is the wrong answer!)
We need, somehow, to find ways to get people engaged in thoughtful, compassionate dialogue. Sure, that doesn't resolve anything by itself but it does raise levels of respect and understanding. Two things that seem to be sorely lacking at present.(I think we're doing a pretty good job here btw!)
I hope we do, but I sometimes worry that SKEPTIKO could get pulled too far into politics! Still we live in exceptional times!

David
 
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"Only" seems a bit pat here as I think people only resist anything because of their culture and personal beliefs. :)

To be honest I probably lean more toward the gun control side though I do think the caricature of people "clinging" to guns, rather than having their own set of principles regarding gun ownership (which aligns to some extent with the argument for drug legalization) is an unfair one.
Well whatever reason various people want to keep guns and resist gun control - my main point is that people only want to do so much to keep themselves safe, and they can be very selective about it.

If people really wanted to stay alive then they'd support gun control, efforts to stem the effects of climate change, food industry regulation etc but they don't. However they will do whatever it takes to tackle what they perceive to be the risk of immigration and terrorism.

I think it's reasonable to conclude that with some people, there is some prejudice that is tribal in nature here.
 
I have a friend who's black and he's actually wondered if he gets less respect from liberals when he tells them he didn't like Hilary than he would discussing with conservatives why he wouldn't vote Trump.

Basically he's "just wrong", but these same people will argue it out with other white people. It's an interesting observation, as John Greer has suggested many a Trump voter isn't interested in skin color - or at least not to the extent claimed as an explanation for Trump's victory.
This is where it's important to differentiate between liberals and left leaning people. I have seen liberals treat Sanders supporters badly and blame them and Sanders for Hilary's loss for example.

Sometimes it is frustrating to see people vote against their own economic or social interests, does that frustrate go too far at times? Of course.

When I say 'against their own interests' I don't mean in my opinion, I'm talking about Republicans who for example, voted for Trump to get rid of Obamacare, but who were personally relying on the ACA for their healthcare, not realising they were the same thing. That is for sure voting against your own interests.
 
Thanks for the response and no worries on the misunderstanding. I was less than clear in my original post!

The topic I highlighted from your response above is of particular interest to me.

As someone who's been more left leaning than right my entire life, I have found myself disgusted by the "left's" behavior since the election and feeling empathy for those who voted for Trump. Especially grating for me is the intellectually superior tone that seems to be constantly evoked by the extremes on the left. (This is noteworthy as its almost, but not quite, as grating as the pre-election attacks on Obama and Hillary that were coming from the extreme right.) Its like a meme I saw recently that I instantly fell in love with: NEVER, in the history of calming down has anyone ever calmed down by being told "calm down". (I think this resonated so much from being a parent and watching first hand how ineffective this approach was with my children.)

That said a lot of what Trump is doing is, for me, potentially serious. I only say potentially as I am not as engaged in investing/research as I could be to really have confidence in either direction. However, things like Trump's handling of his business interests have been a red flag for me. Point being: You may very well be right that time may be of the essence here.

Still, I don't think we'll like the outcome if the folks fighting Trump don't change their tone and their own rhetoric. Another favorite saying I'm sure we've all heard in one variety or another is "If your mouth is moving; you aren't learning". We need, somehow, to find ways to get people engaged in thoughtful, compassionate dialogue. Sure, that doesn't resolve anything by itself but it does raise levels of respect and understanding. Two things that seem to be sorely lacking at present.

(I think we're doing a pretty good job here btw!)
Every time I see your name on this in my head I imagine someone going 'SILENCE'! Hahaha.

Anyway moving on...

I agree again that the general tone should be better, from everyone, and yes some people leaning to the left can be superior at times.

However it has become a common theme to blame the left for nearly everything, and that is something I completely reject.

We haven't had an actually left wing president or party running things in America or the UK for years, Obama for example was a Neoliberal, not left wing if you judge him by his actions - the same goes for Clinton had she won.

It's also worth remembering that it's easy for us to say that some people should calm down about Trump, but some of his policies are very dangerous and massively effect certain groups of people.

Building the wall alienates Mexicans and Hispanics.

The immigration ban massively affects of the lives of anybody from those countries, and will have bad effects for relations between America and those countries.

The Dakota access pipeline is going to be built on and damage sacred Native American grounds.

You mentioned Trumps business interests, he hasn't banned people from other Muslim Majority countries due to his business interests and he still hasn't released his tax returns!

This is very early days as well, I doubt things are going to get better.

Let's attack where the real power lies, and not blame 'the left' for everything!
 
That describes me too - I am in CND, and very much in favour of the peaceful resolution of conflicts. The fact that the "Left" seemed to actually desire to aggravate Russia, was the last straw for me.

Agreed again. The well-off lefties find clever intellectual excuses for policies that are beneficial to themselves (though they may not be sufficiently self-aware to realise that).

If you mean climate change, I don't think I would worry - by far the greatest climate risk is another ice age!

If you mean Trumps dislike of 'free trade' - well the real truth is that free trade has deprived westerners of jobs, and subjected people in poorer countries to something unpleasantly close to slavery.

I suspect that intellectual people pay for their skills by being screened off from a basic common sense that is shared by the bulk of people. I mean, if you spend much of the day studying the curvature of space near a black hole, or the thinking of an obscure medieval poet, you probably pay for that by being less savvy in other ways!

'Ordinary' people really notice the higher bills for electricity, and ask themselves who benefits from the climate change hysteria, and probably compare it with other hysteria, like the dotcom hysteria, or the hysteria over the liberalising of the banks which let them rip everyone off, etc. etc. In short, they have a finely tuned nose for the next scam that will make them poorer!

Yes - they need to really understand why so many people could listen to the media ridiculing Trump day after day, and still go and vote for him! (Hint - saying that the deplorable's are stupid, is the wrong answer!)


I hope we do, but I sometimes worry that SKEPTIKO could get pulled too far into politics! Still we live in exceptional times!

David
1) Glad you're in CND. Who in 'the left' wanted to aggregate Russia? I think you get your political ideologies mixed up at times. Jeremy Corbyn is on 'the left' remember the stick he got for saying NATO were provoking Russia?

2) Who are 'well off lefties'? What policies are they defending that help them? Sounds like you're describing liberals that support Hilary Clinton to me.

3) I think climate change is a pretty severe risk to us all, as are linked issues such as the use of resources and pollution for example. I doubt he was referring to Trump's dislike of free trade, something not usually associated with right wing thinking. He's probably referring to his other more controversial policies,

4) Ordinary people are subject to the same biases and prejudices as anyone else. I also would wajer that most ordinary people accept climate change, and that the marketisation of energy is the main reason for increased energy bills.

5) Calling people 'deplorables' was stupid (again though that's more Clinton and liberals then 'the left'). However many of the statements Trump made and the policies put forward should have been enough to put enough people off. Both candidates were terrible, I was hoping people wouldn't vote for either which to be fair, a lot of people didn't.
 
Let's attack where the real power lies, and not blame 'the left' for everything!
The last line of your post that I've copied made me think twice about this.

It wasn't that I started 'blaming the left', it was that I suddenly realised that they were capable of the same insanity as the 'other side' that I'd assumed were 'wrong' and 'bad' for so long. So that left me with nowhere to go. Thus the sudden feeling of detachment from politics and actually a feeling that I was better off that way. Comparing my feelings with others, I just don't want to be be a part of that 'mob' that are full of anger, I just don't. I'm left deflated in a way, I am content with not knowing where the real power lies, and I'm certainly not motivated to 'attack' anything without being certain that it's a threat to me.

It's the ability to ignore principles and show blind hypocrisy that I feel has blurred the divisions. I didn't think much about Obama's Presidency until last year, I was rather pleased that a black man was somehow the president. I started paying more attention after the Brexit issue, when he came across to lend his support to the remainers cause. I thought to myself, 'this is really not his business' - and just for the record, I voted remain! Then when I read about his record of signing so many drone attack orders, and locking up whistleblowers, basically the same old murderous shite that we've seen for ever from those in power forever, both here and the US.

And so I came to the conclusion that Obama wasn't the kind of President I'd vote for, as he had shaky principles. He was the same as all the rest that had let themselves down. I thought Bernie Saunders looked relatively promising but hey ho. The first obvious clue I had was Brexit. Gee whiz! The countries going mad over Brexit. That's when I saw the 'temporary insanity' of a lot of my friends, as I saw it. Maybe it's because I had a serious life changing event that allowed me to think the way I now do. Ok, so it might be bad.But it's not that bad! Believe me - things could be worse! But we took a vote, the people that have been voted democratically into power decided to take a vote. The same people that took us into the disastrous Iraq was, the same people that hushed up David Kelly's murder, the same experts, the same people that are outraged when one of them criticises the 'experts', the ones that voted to bomb Syria etc etc - basically the same people that do very little that I applaud.

And that's ok. It's the real world, people are doing their best, I couldn't do any better. I get on with my little life.

Then comes Trump! The mass hysteria reaches fever pitch. Facebook is full of people crying, saying all sorts of things, often hateful things. When Obama makes his final speech, my lefty friend are gushing with praise, now I'm not against praise, but this is something more than that. Something that gives me cognitive dissonance! Makes me squirm. The same feeling that I first got when I saw the massive outpouring of grief when Princess Diana died. It was weird then, it's still weird now. What is it that gets into people in certain circumstances? It's like mob rule in a way? Around this time, I get accused of being a 'white supremacist' by some scots 'lady', two of my American friends defriend me in disgust at my posts. Posts that include no offensive language or anything personal, just my honest opinions. I try to get across what I really mean, but eventually decide that there's no point. They have made up their minds! I feel that the talk of '30s Germany is possibly valid!

They are precisely in the same state that we often describe the way sceptics appear on this forum, or at least on some of Alex's podcasts - in a state of cognitive dissonance. It's carefully controlled in the podcasts, but on Facebook and Twitter we see the ugly truth. There's no rational discussion possible with many of them. The Scots woman I mentioned in the previous paragraph, frightens me! But, and this is critical - the 'other side' is capable of exactly the same behaviour. It seems that we are all susceptible to this insanity! And I think it is exactly that.

Now, the hysteria surrounding Trump is just mainly that as far as I can see. What I am saying, is : What is so very different about Trump to Obama, or Hillary for that matter? The Muslims that have suffered in Iraq, and across the Middle East and Libya are forgotten. We seem content to hear constantly how the poor have to eat from food banks, how the uk MPs vote Year after year for 10% pay rises while imposing crippling cuts to vital services for the 'plebs', it goes on and on. Where were the huge protests and the media then? I mean WTF? To me it's all hypocrisy. So you say it's wrong to ban Muslims, but it seems it's ok for them to bomb the shit out of them? We love Hillary and Obama but hate Trump because he's a bit of a narcissist and a sexist and a bit violent etc, when they both have a proven record of being willing to kill foreigners by the thousands? WTF?

It's a mess.

Now to see where I sit, here are some things on my own fantasy wish list! :
Scrapping nuclear weapons,
Prioritise teaching as a profession
Properly organise and fund the Nhs.
Properly fund mental health
Pay people properly
Have small conventional 'armed forces'
Etc, etc
Goodness knows what this would lead to! :eek:

I don't like many of the things that go on elsewhere, but what should we do? I think what we should do is 'live with it', get our own house in order, be the example that others eventually see works well, and might follow. Think Star Trek. At the moment we are definitely not capable of pointing the finger at anyone. Trump won the democratic election!!!!! Democracy is alive and well in the west, such as it is! Oh - I forgot, labour or the greens or the liberal democrats would be so much better in the uk. They wouldn't!

So where am I now? Lost? Dejected? Depressed? NO. I'm just basically the same as I always was, just another pleb trying to make sense of it all. I'm staying upbeat despite all this madness around me. I have my 'faith' that there is purpose to life in spite of it all. Don't get me started on fucking religion! Many American Christians deserve everything they get if you believe in something like Karma. They're really bonkers! ;)

Yet I feel more 'religious' than ever!

I honestly think that if we as the world's human beings could all sit for an hour and think positive thoughts in silence, it would be a 'good thing'. But it's not to be, not for now, at least. So I'll sit and ponder the insanity that makes us the way we are, knowing that we're all on a journey, so the madness is ok for now. As anyone who has read my book will know, concentrating of gratitude and forgiveness and other such virtues is key. It really works for me, try it, let me know if it works for you, 'cos it will. :)

Do a random kind deed today.
 
1) Glad you're in CND. Who in 'the left' wanted to aggregate Russia? I think you get your political ideologies mixed up at times. Jeremy Corbyn is on 'the left' remember the stick he got for saying NATO were provoking Russia?
Well much of the media styles itself as 'Left', but fail to expose the truth about the Ukraine or the Syrian civil war.
2) Who are 'well off lefties'? What policies are they defending that help them? Sounds like you're describing liberals that support Hilary Clinton to me.
Well I think that poorer people would be far more critical of 'climate change'. I think the idea thrives because it feels good to those who have enough money not to be really hurt by the changes. I come to that conclusion because I really honestly (you will have to trust me on that!) don't believe CO2 is the threat that it is claimed to be, and that one or two hard investigative programs on TV could explode the whole nonsense.
3) I think climate change is a pretty severe risk to us all, as are linked issues such as the use of resources and pollution for example. I doubt he was referring to Trump's dislike of free trade, something not usually associated with right wing thinking. He's probably referring to his other more controversial policies,
See above!
4) Ordinary people are subject to the same biases and prejudices as anyone else. I also would wajer that most ordinary people accept climate change, and that the marketisation of energy is the main reason for increased energy bills.
Well a lot of the extra cost comes from the fact that wind and solar power are intermittent. One solution to that, is to keep a gas fired power station on standby to provide energy when the renewable energy isn't available. There are also experiments in creating vast battery banks, but they too are expensive. If generating power from renewables was easy we would have given up on coal years ago - simple market forces would have done that.

You need to realise that a lot of people are against climate change, not because they get money from 'big oil', or because they are 'right wing', or because they are stupid. They don't try and do a head-count of scientists (I mean, heck you would surely find a majority of scientists would agree with materialism - at least on the record), they have looked at the evidence and realised just how shaky the theory of CAGW really is.
5) Calling people 'deplorables' was stupid (again though that's more Clinton and liberals then 'the left'). However many of the statements Trump made and the policies put forward should have been enough to put enough people off. Both candidates were terrible, I was hoping people wouldn't vote for either which to be fair, a lot of people didn't.
Well unless you exclude the MSM from being 'left', you have to admit that they did their damndest to get her elected, and we might have been in a standoff with Russia right now had she won! Arguing with people on the left can be a bit like arguing about the sins of the Church to a Christian, or I am sure arguing about the sins of Islam with a Moslem - they redefine the concept to exclude all the people and organisations that they disapprove of!

David
 
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